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This is Long John once again with the party line.

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We're round from midnight to 5.30, six mornings during the week.

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And Hans, Stephon, Sanderson and Morris K. Jessup are now removing their coats.

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What do you expect to battle this morning then?

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Well, if we don't get it, one heart will be here for us.

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No, that's right.

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Well, we're going to be talking this morning with four or five different people.

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Hans, Stephon, Sanderson is the editorial director of Fantastic Universe.

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We were talking about that publication the other morning,

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because in the current edition, the August edition of Fantastic Universe,

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there are two very important articles for people who are interested in the flying saucer phenomena.

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The first article is UFO, Friend or Fold, written by Ivan T. Sanderson.

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And Mr. Sanderson has been a guest of the party line.

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The other article is written by Lester Delray, entitled The Flying Saucer Myth.

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Both of these articles are certainly worthwhile reading,

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because you'll get the... well, you'll get the opinions of two well-known men in the field.

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Definitely, Lester Delray does not buy the flying saucer story.

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Mr. Sanderson, well, he has an opinion, and I think that he should read the August edition of Fantastic Universe.

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It's available on your newsstands. This is not a commercial,

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but I know so many of you people are interested in the stories about flying saucers

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that you'll want to read this copy.

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dated August, Fantastic Universe, and Hans, Stephon, Sanderson, one of my guests this evening,

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is the editorial director of that publication.

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Morrishay Jessup is with us, the author of the new book about flying saucers,

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The Expanding Case for the UFOs.

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We'll also have Dan Fry with us and George Van Passell.

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Mr. Fry is the gentleman that claims that he took a trip in a flying saucer from a desert spot

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on the white sand-proving ground in New Mexico,

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took the trip in the flying saucers from that point to the city of New York,

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and back in a period of 32 minutes.

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That's pretty fast.

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According to Mr. Fry, he doesn't feel that that's too fast.

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He feels that that can be accomplished by many people.

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And I understand this evening that they gave a lecture at the diplomat hotel.

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I stopped in for around three or four minutes, and I must say that there were quite a few people there.

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Is that right, George?

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Well, John, I probably could have held another 50th. They'd stood them up.

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I don't know where. Probably in the lobby downstairs.

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Well, it was about in the upstairs. It's still that little standing room.

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Still that little...

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Yeah.

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George Greedy. George Greedy, believe me.

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I thought we were going to have a riot when Long John didn't show up.

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Apparently about two-thirds of the people there came as far as much to see Long John as I did to see you, Van.

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Well, very likely, because the show hands in the audience when we asked him how many were there through to this broadcast.

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I would say 50%.

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No, 50, maybe even two-thirds.

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It was an awful lot of hands.

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But when the court announced that Long John had been there and then left, where they tore the place down...

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They turned the dead, they applauded, shook the place down a little bit through.

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I wondered why there were police cars near the dead.

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Well, that was it.

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Well, now that we've gone along with the jokes for the evening men...

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This isn't a joke, George.

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You just don't realize how well you're like.

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That's right.

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Well, that's the job Long John.

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I think that's true.

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You know the way you say that, that can be taken two ways.

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You take it either way, friend. You just take it either way.

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If you read some of my mail, you'll find that there are some people that want me to.

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I get that right. I get that kind of mail, too.

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Well, how do you think the audience received the two stories tonight?

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Your story, George and Dan Frye.

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Well, the same way they always receive it.

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With a knowing and an understanding of a simple subject, explain simply.

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Inflang sauces?

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I consider it a simple subject.

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Simple to the extent that if the science of their operation is known,

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it's much more simple and less complex than any mechanism we have.

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Well, I think you're aware of the fact that I have talked to possibly 15 or 20 different people

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who profess to have a knowledge of the subject of flying saucers,

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and I possibly have spent some hundred hours on the subject,

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and I must admit that I still don't know how they operate or why they're coming here,

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and I'm still a little confused.

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Well, John, your groove is this particular program,

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you're doing an awful good job with it, and maybe you're not supposed to know.

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I see.

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Well, I then...

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We can't all do the same thing.

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Anything else new?

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No, you see, their basic science of religion and science and culture and social things

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are all established on the same principle.

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Now, when you say they, you're referring to people who are living on other planets.

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On other planets or in space, completely free from planets.

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Or living in space.

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Oh, yes. There's a lot of them, too.

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Indeed, John, the word, day, in flying saucer parlance is spelled with a capital T,

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and it's practically a technical word.

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When anybody in the flying saucer van or somebody who's been contacted uses the word, day,

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if you know the phrase, there's a special emphasis on the word.

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Well, there's another phrase, too, that's used on the program by many of the people

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who feel that they have some knowledge of flying saucers, and the phrase is the people.

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Oh, these people.

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These people.

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These people.

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Or these people.

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Yeah, it's the same thing.

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It's practically a proper name and spelled with a capital letter.

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So if I say that a group of people, they went to the palace tonight,

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would that mean they're from outer space?

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If you're talking to Dr. Francis, my fellow...

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Well, I'm learning.

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Well, good.

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Hans, what do you think about the flying saucer?

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Well, I'm just interested.

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Better end on the Sanderson.

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Oh, sorry.

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I thought that you were a new Yorker.

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Fantastic.

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Hello, fantastic.

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And the famous non-Lyland witness,

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I was just discussing some time back, you know,

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what I think to do.

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I was struck by what you said just now,

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because I don't know if you've seen our current issue.

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You aren't going to vlog that thing.

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Yeah, I'm not.

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Our current issue of a magazine which has been named,

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please, Mr. Justice, I do want you to write an article for us, you know.

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I'm still debating that.

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In that, I even sent a term in this,

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in his article in this unnamed magazine,

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to refer it to a possible alternative about the UFOs.

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This is something that the Air Force has made to once consider,

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though it seems finally to have abandoned the idea.

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It is simply that some UFOs may themselves be alive.

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This is to say, they may be a life form equivalent to,

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but not specifically, either animal, vegetable, or virus,

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that may dwell in the upper atmosphere of this or all planets,

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or live in space itself.

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When you were talking about they,

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were you there first talking about suggesting that

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they may have been these life forms that I was referring to in this article?

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No, I wasn't.

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But I have a particular contact

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that I have never discussed,

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hopefully publicly, either in lectures or over the air,

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in which these particular people are not like us.

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However, they have many advantages over us.

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The one thing they don't have to walk around like they do.

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They move by an accident, we call it levitation,

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and they don't have to turn when they go anywhere

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because of the shape,

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shaped like an electric light bulb.

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In fact, in the comic strips, they once called a snow.

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The only difference is that they have 32 eyes

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and they ring completely around their head,

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and they don't have to turn to look, either.

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I can see in all directions.

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Are you talking about people who came from another planet?

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I'm talking about intelligent beings.

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Intelligent beings.

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They are not.

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Other than us.

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I don't really know whether we can pass up with them or not,

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but nevertheless, these beings live in space.

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They are not subject to temperature.

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They feel, season or cold, they touch them.

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They said that they have a field around their individual body

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that is perfectly strong to repel or ward off

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any of our 30 caliber machine guns bullets.

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And that they can move in and out of their ships

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because they don't breathe air like we do.

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And they can move around in space.

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They don't require to breathe.

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And they don't have any legs, for a simple reason,

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that they levitate at all times.

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Do you say that you spoke?

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Yeah, I spoke directly with these people.

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To these people?

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What language?

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Well, in cross communication, you know,

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I'm only one language.

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It isn't a language of English or Chinese or whatever it may be.

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I thought it's what it is and it can't be anything else.

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Did you see them?

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Indirectly, yes.

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I'm not in a being they projected, I saw them.

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Was this at Giant Rock Airport?

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Yes, this is at Giant Rock.

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Underneath the rocks?

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Underneath the rocks.

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Underneath the rocks?

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Underneath the rocks.

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And you know, I'm glad Hans brought that up

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because in all the research I've done

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covering literature for thousands of years,

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let's start off saying cross-ups and pendulum.

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There are always, if you read a few hours

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in almost any class of literature,

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you will come to references

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which cannot possibly be anything but beings of non-human form.

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Discarnation, intelligence, or uncarnation, intelligence,

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and I have to be careful with the word carnation

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because even my time has come,

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I think it's a time in some fields at church.

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But I'm very glad to have that subject brought up

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and get a little past the case now.

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There's more than one kind of pre-fold U.S. over

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and a fan pointed out, or prior last night,

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that my con-

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use of the word carnation is extremely unfortunate

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because there's so many different types

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of entity or structure in space and in the sky

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that's just classifying them as it may be past.

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But in time, that's like a brand new...

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Yeah, U.S.O. isn't even a proper title.

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Well, I don't even understand a part of it.

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Even the Air Force has used U.S.O.

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as unidentified flying objects,

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yet they know what they are.

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So they're really identified flying objects.

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They do?

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Oh, definitely.

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They've got at least six of the ships that they have.

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Where?

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They were forced down to mechanical failures

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and at least six of them are left.

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One time they were right-handed from fields

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and now I believe they're all under private research

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and various companies around the country.

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Mm-hmm.

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What happened to the pilots of the...

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or intelligence of piloting the...

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Well, I wouldn't know except the one that Frank Scully was about.

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The bodies were taken from us.

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They were all there being a ship outside of us.

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Well, hasn't that been a suggestion or a rumor around rally

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that the Scully story has improved to be a hoax?

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No, it has never been proven to be a hoax.

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And neither has the data with true printed about Cy Newton.

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I know Cy Newton personally and I know Frank Scully personally.

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And the individual who was a freelance writer

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who wrote those articles

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was not speaking for true magazine.

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He was speaking to himself and he had a personal drug

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that he was taking out because in his first effort to contact Scully and Newton

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on the subject, Scully knew that he was trying to get a hold of some of the material

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which Newton had.

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And so he crashed with Cy, so finally Cy slipped into Tony.

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It wasn't Tony, it was just a rumoring stuff,

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which this man eventually found out was quickly left to the aircraft material

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and before he brought it out,

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Cy had perpetuated a hoax because this was the material from the ship.

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Cy knew what the guy was trying to do all along

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and so he just helped him along by giving him the stuff.

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Not that you apparently did on a more recent occasion.

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Well, I didn't give out any material that I know of.

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Well, in the sense that you also feel like you are thinking of the Tony.

251
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Oh, well, let me interrupt the moment.

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Mr. Sanderson was on the program last morning.

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You'll change your name when we told us about the show.

254
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Well, I didn't know if you were aware of the fact that Mr. Sanderson is on the program that morning.

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Well, before we get into the discussion of the morning,

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here's a message from one of our sponsors out in Newark.

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We're talking this morning with Dan Fry and George Van Passel on Stefan Sanderson,

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the editorial director of Van Passet's Universe is with us

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and just to remind you again, in the August edition,

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let's return to the thing that's on your newsstand.

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There are two articles, two startling articles about flying saucers.

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One written by Ivan T. Sanderson, entitled UFO, Friend or Fold.

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The other written by Lester Del Rey, the flying saucer myth.

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We also have with us the author of many books on the subject of flying saucers,

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Morse K. Jeffers, his most recent book, The Extending Case,

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for the UFO, published by Citadel Press.

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Dan Fry, I know that you possibly have read some of the articles that have appeared in the various magazines,

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such as Fantastic Universe and other publications.

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How do you feel about these articles that have appeared about flying saucers?

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Well, I have never had any criticism, John, about the opinion of the authors of these articles,

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because everyone's right to have their own opinion on any subject,

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and it is also their right to express that opinion within the issue at any time and any place.

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The only criticism I would have of most of the articles that have appeared

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is that the individual who is written these articles in most cases

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apparently sent almost no time or effort in determining the facts containing the things about which he writes.

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I don't mean the factuality or non-factuality of the subject itself,

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but the little details of the individual who are described.

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There have been articles in which I have been mentioned, and I have been mentioned,

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and others who have had experience, I have been mentioned,

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in which our names are in crisis, while our ages were in crisis,

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given our experiences were mixed up and turned up,

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and there are articles in which almost nothing stated in there as facts is actually facts.

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In other words, you feel that they didn't do an adequate amount of research

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prior to writing the article, as far as the facts could be determined readily yet.

285
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You are referring mostly to articles of what you might call a negative nature.

286
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I have planned the whole idea of the UFO and stuff.

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Do you think that there is anybody who could be considered to be a qualified expert on the subject of flying saucers?

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Well, this would be more a question of the definition of the term,

289
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what is an expert and what is a qualification.

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I think that anyone who wants to write an article on the subject

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could readily obtain the facts that is described by the individual's name,

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his first name, his place of residence, and things like this, which are readily attainable.

293
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And if these are put in correctly, then the individual is welcome to have anything on the subject, which he chooses.

294
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Well, how about the story, forgetting about the fact that possibly they have misspelled a name or possibly misscoded an age?

295
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Do you think that they have been fair in their opinion of the people who claim that they have had physical contact with people from other planets?

296
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Well, I don't see how the, in many cases, how the opinions could be fair or otherwise,

297
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because they simply have no basis on which to formulate anything.

298
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I have read a number of stories. One was in the Munchmise disease a year and a half ago,

299
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which began with a snare at the fidelity of people who would believe in the sort of inward, as it was put except data without proof.

300
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The author then went on to give quite a long article in which there wasn't one single statement.

301
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Wasn't one single statement a fact?

302
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:33,000
Do you remember some of the untrue statements?

303
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:46,000
Yes, I remember some as well. Let's put it this way. The article started out with a quotation of what I had said in a talk at the Spacecraft Convention.

304
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I had made no such statement. I had not even approached that particular subject in any way.

305
00:19:53,000 --> 00:20:00,000
The article began by describing this Middle-Aid rocket-technique in Van Thij, which was for the C.L.I.D.

306
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:06,000
I had no objection to people describing me as Middle-Aid, but the interesting thing was that in the next paragraph,

307
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this individual referred to Tim and Betham as the young rodentan, who happened to Tim and Betham the same years old as 9-um.

308
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:21,000
This literally turned all down, but this writer of this article had never met either of myself or Mr. Betham,

309
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,000
had he ever met anyone who had met either of us?

310
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Is he a rodent mechanic?

311
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:26,000
He is a rodent mechanic.

312
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:32,000
Would you think the difference in the age and the miscorting of the age is of great importance to the story itself?

313
00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:39,000
Well, it was an evidence that if the individual who wrote it had no basis for making his determination or an opinion on one way or the other,

314
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he hadn't invested in getting the subject and not to be able to formulate it.

315
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:47,000
Maybe he had something better fit for him than the back of the jacket.

316
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:52,000
You know, Betham looked up again and he was in the book of the whole...

317
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:57,000
The whole article was written in a vein of ridicule, again, when I remember the article,

318
00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:03,000
and I was described as a high school graduate, which was again an error,

319
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,000
and numerous things.

320
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:12,000
I mean, it's so obvious that every sentence had an error at the end of the sometimes due to the fact

321
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:16,000
that the man had never contacted any of the people who had talked to or the ones he was writing about.

322
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:22,000
He evidently said that he had been dreamed all this up in the fine-trough of the game,

323
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:26,000
why, of course, he would have been declared immediately as someone having a loophamation,

324
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:32,000
but in the writing game, why, it was accepted because they could put things around for badly anyway,

325
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:35,000
it's normally separate that way.

326
00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:42,000
Have you read any of the articles that have appeared in the monthly publication that is put out by

327
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:47,000
published by PSI, Civilian Scholar Intelligents?

328
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,000
I don't know whether I've read any of these basic ones.

329
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:54,000
They make it a point not to send those bulletin' to if I get young,

330
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,000
because they're anti-contacts, I understand, and they don't need anybody's head in the contact,

331
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:03,000
and so the people that have had contact don't get their litigies.

332
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:08,000
The most interesting thing about it is that it can be used as news concerning the article.

333
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:13,000
The writer almost always starts out as a sort of a narrative, a fidelity of his people

334
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:18,000
who accept testimony without having proof,

335
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,000
and then the individual proceeds to write an article,

336
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:26,000
or has not a word of truth in it, and in fact, it is used to swallow it, a whole lot of it, in the book.

337
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:28,000
This is always a new thing that you see as a son.

338
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,000
Well, I'm an editor at the time of just one moment, Moin.

339
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:32,000
Go ahead.

340
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,000
As an editor, Han, how do you feel about that?

341
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,000
I'm tamed.

342
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,000
You're even most tamed.

343
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,000
It's worth it, you're much of an expression on a plate.

344
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:45,000
When I say tamed, I say this because, thank you, I'm wrong.

345
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:48,000
Sorry that you had such unpleasant experiences.

346
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:51,000
I know that at least in the fantastic universe,

347
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:58,000
we have made every effort to be as accurate and as objective in every part as possible.

348
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:01,000
For example, I'm sure you won't find any,

349
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:08,000
anything wrong with the description of Thu and Bethraim as a genuine engineer and a welder

350
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,000
which is based on his own book.

351
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:18,000
And similarly, in other material, when we have had honor piercings and some reason to mention anyone,

352
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,000
we will be congratulated to Thu.

353
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,000
Oh, we've got other people there.

354
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,000
We've got other people there.

355
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:29,000
As far as CSI, well, that in theory, we were not doing the science fiction article

356
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,000
when you have an article on this content page,

357
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:35,000
where there are people who claim to have had these experiences.

358
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:38,000
I mean, you know, this is the article I'm trying to say.

359
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,000
I wasn't aware that it was a science fiction.

360
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:48,000
But if you serve CSI and I must say this,

361
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:50,000
and I've very gentle disagreements with you,

362
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:56,000
I think I'd use to be a little objective.

363
00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:02,000
I'm quite sure that you are not mistaken or that you are mistaken

364
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:06,000
and that you misunderstand the failures that you're witnessing.

365
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:11,000
We were referring only to a few particular stories which were written

366
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,000
that which we know were never researched

367
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,000
because no one had ever contacted us or anyone that we knew of.

368
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,000
We were exactly into making the article.

369
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:24,000
Let me give you an example.

370
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:30,000
I am frankly, I don't deny that I am mildly skeptical about anything.

371
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,000
I was like a hypocrite to you, I was like a child,

372
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:38,000
by not only by both the youth that I was and others who had appeared on John's program,

373
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:43,000
but on the other hand, I would tell you exactly the same thing I told Howard Hanger.

374
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,000
Show me.

375
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:50,000
And if you show me, I'll go as far along the way as the part that we can with you.

376
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:54,000
But until you show me, I'll tell you some documents.

377
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:58,000
Not in the way that has been done us to now,

378
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:01,000
but in a way that has a research factor.

379
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:07,000
I can personally at least conflict that I would be willing to go along with you.

380
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:13,000
In the meantime, I am forced as an editor responsible to my readers

381
00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:18,000
to rely on the system targets of material.

382
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:23,000
In our case, what happens to be the organization you research here,

383
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:30,000
is that the CSI decision tells the intelligence to my account to be very sincere,

384
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:35,000
very thorough, very analytical in their approach, and super answered.

385
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:39,000
A little critical I think, personally, is that the other side of the thing,

386
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:43,000
that they are their attempts to document things.

387
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,000
Well, their attempts to document the contact with me was done

388
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:49,000
because nobody can see if I have a contact with me

389
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:53,000
and I were asking questions all, and yet they definitely say

390
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:57,000
and have their readers to see if they all contact with the host.

391
00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,000
Or a family.

392
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:04,000
I think the person December 15th, you know, the bulletin was in it.

393
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:08,000
They had a, the bulletin by the day and a half.

394
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,000
Yes, they had a by the day and a half.

395
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,000
And I didn't expect it to be until that,

396
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:16,000
and that's why I didn't bring any ammunition with me.

397
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:24,000
I read one article, and it's the, wrote up to me in particular,

398
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:30,000
and the talks about my hallucinations and their so forth, and yet none of them

399
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:38,000
had ever contact me, and they'd find out what I was like, or what my experience was directly or anything else.

400
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:42,000
Halechinations? I don't remember, well, it wasn't a word,

401
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:44,000
but I don't know how or what word they did use,

402
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:48,000
but it was strictly a detrimental art artist in this entirely,

403
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:53,000
implying that I just, or the pipe cleaner or something like that,

404
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,000
an entire artist in space on that.

405
00:26:55,000 --> 00:27:03,000
And, I don't know how they consider it to be investigators or intelligence

406
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,000
when the Reagan artist is about a man they never talked to and know all about it.

407
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:11,000
I think, yeah, there's some, at least, the auspil in the December issue,

408
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:15,000
that some of their people have talked to.

409
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:21,000
I would like to just add this into the conversation.

410
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:30,000
I have no Ted Blosch's personally, and a couple of the other members of PSI,

411
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,000
and I enjoyed having them on the program,

412
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,000
but I've taken issue with him under Howard Mendes' case.

413
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:41,000
Now, I can understand that they have a limited amount of money,

414
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,000
they have to budget themselves, and I would say that it would be difficult

415
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:51,000
to go all the way out to California to visit George Van Tassel or to visit the fan side.

416
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:57,000
But I felt that, at least they should have investigated the Howard Mendes story,

417
00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:01,000
and I don't think that they did that. Now, they may take issue with this thing.

418
00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:03,000
I think they may.

419
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,000
Well, they criticize it.

420
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,000
Well, at least John and all of the US males are making part of the article,

421
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:13,000
and I have to put him on something that he didn't write about.

422
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:15,000
Well, that's very true.

423
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:21,000
I'm a little inclined to take similar issues to hand

424
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:27,000
on the being, at least, mildly skeptical in some of these cases,

425
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:34,000
because we have to distinguish between two types of what you might call negative articles.

426
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:40,000
The thing that Stan Fly started out talking about a while ago was the article written

427
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,000
by what you might call a professional debunker.

428
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:50,000
A debunker has to be a debunker. He hasn't got any occupations.

429
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:59,000
And if he keeps it up, he does run into the situation where he doesn't have legitimate

430
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:03,000
or at least accurate information to do with it.

431
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:12,000
Now, I don't think the CSI boys are quite the famous category as professional debunkers.

432
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:18,000
I think the biggest trouble is that like, whether you're a dead bloke or both of whom I know

433
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:25,000
and consider very good friends, the racist couple with him is simply a useful enthusiast.

434
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:30,000
I'm writing for ghetto on one of these things, and writing is a little hardy,

435
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:35,000
and they are just trying and doing. On the basis that Stan points out,

436
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:42,000
the special knowledge they have in hand are times when I'm inclined to agree with him,

437
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:46,000
and not to make the right of his statements in any case.

438
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:55,000
It's my privilege to agree or not to agree with my privilege to make unwanted and unbounded statements.

439
00:29:55,000 --> 00:30:01,000
Well, as very pointed out, I have no objection to any conclusion that anyone who has that

440
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,000
provided that that conclusion is based on the reason in which one has researched the universe

441
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:11,000
on destination. As you say, there are some people who are called professional scoffers

442
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:16,000
who make a living by sharing the things that they know nothing about.

443
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:21,000
It doesn't matter what they know anything about them or not, because their only good job is to share anything with them.

444
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:27,000
There's another thing that hasn't occurred to a lot of people in regard to contact stories,

445
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:32,000
and that is that these stories can be proved that they cannot be disclosed.

446
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:37,000
When Man says he saw something, he cannot possibly prove that he didn't do it,

447
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:41,000
as he may be, and by the way, I think it proves that he did.

448
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:49,000
And if you want that at the time, it's a little dangerous to say that that is definitely untrue.

449
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:56,000
Well, have you ever met anybody more skeptical that they've claimed that they've had a physical contact

450
00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:04,000
or a number of physical contacts with people from other planets and that they've been able to offer you any proof?

451
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:10,000
I don't think anybody has ever offered me anything that I could call proof.

452
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:14,000
Of course, I haven't made any serious efforts to find a proof either.

453
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,000
Well, you've talked with a lot of these people more.

454
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:21,000
I've talked to just a few people.

455
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,000
You've talked to Howard.

456
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:23,000
I've talked to Howard.

457
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:24,000
I know of this program.

458
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:25,000
You've talked to Dan.

459
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:26,000
I know of Dan.

460
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:27,000
George Van Patel.

461
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:28,000
George Van Patel.

462
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:29,000
Oh, I see.

463
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:33,000
And one or two other people.

464
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:40,000
I've played, I haven't yet been confronted with anything, which I consider an iron-crad proof.

465
00:31:40,000 --> 00:32:00,000
But, certainly, I have no proof except an overwhelming mass of personal reports or what you might call eye-witness evidence.

466
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:05,000
And you either accept it or you follow through the wires outright.

467
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:10,000
You have to be almost as if you do one or the other if you're expressing opinions.

468
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:18,000
And so far, I haven't felt that I've qualified to express a definite opinion one way or the other.

469
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:23,000
I am not convinced of the accuracy of statements.

470
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:29,000
I don't question anybody who has good intentions or integrity in this matter.

471
00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:34,000
I do question the accuracy of the good deal that I have been told.

472
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,000
But I have no loophs negatively or positively.

473
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:50,000
And I certainly am not going out on the limb as the last CSI does, and stating flatly that what somebody said he did is not true, I can't prove.

474
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:54,000
And I'm not going to make myself as a true limiter.

475
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,000
I think we ought to look into this term proof a little bit.

476
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,000
We hear this word used a lot.

477
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,000
What would you consider proof?

478
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:10,000
Well, it would be on the spot. You must have been looking to some of the programs because I brought this point up myself.

479
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:22,000
What would be proof? In other words, if you brought me a publication here and you told me that this was a magazine that printed on the planet Mars, I don't know what I could say about it.

480
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,000
I could say once again, well, I don't buy it.

481
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:33,000
If you brought me a piece of metal, if you brought me a piece of fabric or anything, very frankly, this would not prove anything to me.

482
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,000
I'll have to admit that to you.

483
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:43,000
I would say that proof would be to me, just talking off the cuff.

484
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:52,000
I would say that possibly actually seen by Saucerland, not having somebody point up in the sky and say, you see that?

485
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:55,000
And possibly I do see something up there.

486
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,000
And I don't know what it is.

487
00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:02,000
And whoever's pointing it out to me would say, well, John, that's the Saucer.

488
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:06,000
Well, this would be difficult for me to buy.

489
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:13,000
Another bit of proof would be possibly to witness some of these telepathic communications.

490
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:23,000
Also, another, you know, I was going to say, John, tell the people it wouldn't prove anything to me either because we've been told by Howard Mendes that they look like first people.

491
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,000
So what would I know?

492
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:31,000
Right there, I would like to know how you would witness a telepathic communication.

493
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:36,000
I can't, yes, I can.

494
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:47,000
I have been told by some people on the program who will remain nameless at the present time, because we will not discuss them, that they can be sitting in their home, in the room in their home.

495
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:53,000
And when they do receive a telepathic communication, it is audible to other people sitting in the room.

496
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:58,000
So if that is so, why can't I hear it?

497
00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:02,000
In other words, John, you mean if you heard this, then this would be proof?

498
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,000
To me, yes.

499
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:09,000
I agree with you that it wouldn't be proof to possibly many people who may listen to the program.

500
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:12,000
It would be proof of at least.

501
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:23,000
Hey, message, however, I also do know, because I have a little knowledge of magic and a little knowledge of pseudo-mind reading, that I would be able to do this for you.

502
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:29,000
But if I witnessed this phenomena, then in turn I would like to investigate the room.

503
00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:37,000
John, one thing is said, assuming that you, let's say right now, appear in a cut and effect.

504
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:41,000
What proof do you have of it, that there is still origin of that mechanism?

505
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,000
That is very true.

506
00:35:43,000 --> 00:36:06,000
I would say this, that if I had the opportunity to investigate, to look over the house, the room, wherever I may be, and if I didn't find any mechanical or electronic equipment there, then I would be led to believe that something is happening, that I cannot understand.

507
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:13,000
So therefore, I would say, well, possibly this may be one of these telepathic communications.

508
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:20,000
And when I say that, I don't mean to infer that I'm a genius when it comes to the magic of pseudo-mind reading.

509
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:24,000
I am not, but I have a little more knowledge than the average color of the screen.

510
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:28,000
When you say it may be, you certainly are not calling it proof.

511
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,000
Well, I did, it boiled down to the fact that all of this material is evidence.

512
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,000
There is no such thing as absolute proof.

513
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:39,000
I mean, you want to carry this to a practical conclusion, you can show that there is no such thing as absolute proof of anything.

514
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:55,000
Well, would you consider, John, in 1952, I notified the airport that the process was on a bus in Washington before the bus was, by registering a mail letter, that it would be turned to a fee for three times.

515
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:59,000
And the event happened exactly as I told them it was going to happen.

516
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,000
They were barged in Washington, the radar and told us that the other morning.

517
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:04,000
Yeah.

518
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:07,000
And John Matt and so forth, and many witnesses who testified.

519
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:10,000
May I just say this to answer that question?

520
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:19,000
And I'm not trying to imply that I don't have confidence in you as an individual as being an honest and fair person.

521
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:38,000
The fact that you have a receipt from a registered letter that proves that they did receive a registered letter in the Pentagon or the president, whoever you address the two does not necessarily prove to me the content of that letter.

522
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:42,000
You may have sent a birthday card saying happy birthday, president.

523
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:46,000
You know, I first thought, guy like you, come along.

524
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,000
So I also sent a copy.

525
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:53,000
No, no, I just foresaw a character like you.

526
00:37:53,000 --> 00:38:02,000
So I also sent a exact copy of the same information to the Los Angeles Examiner and the life magazine at the same time.

527
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:05,000
They also received copies of that letter.

528
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:07,000
Have they ever acknowledged that letter?

529
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,000
Not other than signing the return receipt.

530
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:13,000
Well, now at this point, I must say, I'm saying this publicly.

531
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:15,000
I have no reason to doubt it.

532
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:24,000
It would seem to me that life was a little lashed and also the heart paper out in Los Angeles was a little lashed and not following this up.

533
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,000
I think that this would make a front page headline.

534
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:31,000
Yeah, but to see when something says to press, they suppress.

535
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:32,000
They don't follow anything.

536
00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:33,000
I'm just under surprise.

537
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:34,000
Right.

538
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:44,000
In other words, you're implying that the United States government has suggested to the editors of life and to the editors of the Los Angeles Examiner that they could not.

539
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:47,000
I'm not suggesting who did anything.

540
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,000
I'm just suggesting it's being done.

541
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:55,000
I know editors myself who are totally personally they have been told not to print it.

542
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,000
Well, I don't want to go in and be.

543
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,000
I don't want to be recited.

544
00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:02,000
What I'm going to add is, hey, why don't they tell me to stop?

545
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:07,000
Well, there may be a purpose in it now, but there wasn't then.

546
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:08,000
Maybe a reason.

547
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:09,000
Who's purpose?

548
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:16,000
There may be a purpose in having you bring out all these various things for their information.

549
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:20,000
But did they already know it?

550
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:24,000
I know top engineers and aviation students.

551
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:32,000
I came to my place regularly hoping to find out something about the method by which they could control something that I thought.

552
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:39,000
It was led me to believe that they were connected with research that might be conducted on these causes, which I thought controlled.

553
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:42,000
And the fact that they didn't know how to control them.

554
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:47,000
And I readily agreed to help them in any way I could.

555
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:48,000
And in fact, I did.

556
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,000
I told them exactly what to do and how to do it.

557
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:54,000
But they still don't know how to do it because they have no knowledge of thought to use.

558
00:39:54,000 --> 00:40:01,000
I'd have to give them a two-year course on how to work with thought before they come in.

559
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,000
Anybody can learn.

560
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:04,000
Anybody can learn.

561
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,000
Is there anything that you can take?

562
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,000
Yeah, definitely.

563
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:10,000
Anybody?

564
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:11,000
Anybody.

565
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:17,000
Well, I can take a question that they're sending me in the past 25 years or something like that.

566
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,000
We'll say the average person or many people.

567
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:21,000
The average person.

568
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:25,000
You mean that the person doesn't require what's called psychic ability?

569
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:26,000
No.

570
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:29,000
There's no psychic ability connected with it.

571
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:31,000
Psychic ability is an intuitive thing.

572
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,000
That's something we get by first.

573
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:36,000
I like hunting, so you can call it hunting.

574
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:43,000
And the thought of communication, thought of it as a mechanical means of doing something.

575
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:51,000
I mean, steps you look at things as they just do the same as the mission or timing of an automobile.

576
00:40:51,000 --> 00:41:01,000
Last night I heard Dan fly a secret base to the federal family saying they have an electronic process.

577
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,000
Is that right, Dan?

578
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:07,000
Well, I say that it could be demonstrated electronically.

579
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:12,000
It could be done more in a parallel rather than...

580
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:22,000
Yes, I was attempting to make the process understandable to a person who has studied electronics and hasn't studied machinery.

581
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:25,000
No, it can be demonstrated electronically.

582
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,000
It can be used by a device to do it.

583
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,000
Well, now let's get back to this word first, again.

584
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:41,000
Dan said a while ago that under certain circumstances it can almost be impossible to prove anything.

585
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:50,000
I think it is a little bit, because I believe you can always carry knowledge back to a point where it is provable.

586
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:58,000
For instance, I believe you would all agree that we are here on the Earth and that that is provable.

587
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:09,000
In some places, when that kind of statement ends, one of the right things that we may call at first time is the two situations.

588
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:29,000
But this matter of what constitutes two is about a flying saucer, a space pass, a UFO, it intrigues me because I have never yet seen a person dream up any circumstance, situation, or object which would actually constitute two things,

589
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:34,000
for the law or before a jury of scientists.

590
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:36,000
Dan, have you got any idea on that?

591
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:40,000
Well, that's a question of cumulative evidence.

592
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:48,000
This question was once brought up, he remembered, to the ex-cad of the law or before.

593
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:51,000
He was asked if he believed in saucers.

594
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:55,000
Can you suggest I believe that they're real?

595
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,000
And he was asked if he'd ever seen one.

596
00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:59,000
He said, no, I've never seen one.

597
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,000
And he says, I've never seen a theory either.

598
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:03,000
But I believe that it exists.

599
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,000
And we can take that as a good starting point.

600
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:09,000
I might ask, though, what it is, we'll believe it's a continental axiode.

601
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,000
Most of us would say that we do.

602
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:19,000
But if you try to prove, by a material proof, that that continent exists, isn't it going to hurt one's uncle's trust?

603
00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:21,000
Well, I see your point.

604
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:30,000
You can imagine a tremendous amount of evidence, but no one sees to that evidence as going to be proof because every bit of it could have been tested, every bit of it could have been arranged, every bit of it could have been manipulated.

605
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:32,000
That's exactly why.

606
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:36,000
And I have a massive cumulative evidence, which is the only thing you can't prove to people.

607
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:46,000
In my books, I've taken the attitude that I know a sense of faith as evidence for blind saucers that the other presented might stand on his own feet.

608
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:56,000
But when you have enough indication to stand a match to being proof, and when you come right down to it, you cannot pass it with proof.

609
00:43:56,000 --> 00:44:06,000
The sun is going to rise tomorrow morning. It has been doing it for millions of years, but it may not go up tomorrow morning, but we won't be there.

610
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:07,000
Alright, then.

611
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,000
Can I listen to him, please?

612
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:13,000
Can you tell us a few things about him?

613
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:17,000
How do you feel about him?

614
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:31,000
Well, I had a crippled boy and his wife came into my place one day, and he told me he was going to discuss blind saucers.

615
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:36,000
And I said, well, why do you want to discuss blind saucers? Have you ever seen one?

616
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:39,000
And he said, no, I never have.

617
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,000
I said, well, why do you believe there are such men?

618
00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:46,000
And he said, well, I believe in God, and I never saw him either.

619
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:50,000
So what kind of an answer are you going to give him, a person, when they answer you like that?

620
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:51,000
Yes.

621
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:55,000
Belief is something similar to faith.

622
00:44:55,000 --> 00:45:02,000
Only belief is actually a patient from the word be-lie, which means counter- faith.

623
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:06,000
Belief is a counter- faith, that's what it amounts to.

624
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:10,000
But it cannot be detected from the real faith.

625
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:17,000
The thing you're in college with, you're in the University of Jerusalem with the Dura, faith institutes, or faith psychology.

626
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:19,000
Is that a psychological research?

627
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:20,000
No, it is.

628
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:22,000
How do you go about...

629
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:26,000
How do you find the wisdom, let him answer the question first, you have to claim it.

630
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:29,000
Yeah, we probably have...

631
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:39,000
We are probably the only group that I know of in the United States that you could call the saucer-minded or saucer-rearchers

632
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:41,000
that are actually doing something about it.

633
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:48,000
We're not still trying to find out if these things are or are published cites, or never published cites.

634
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:52,000
We are trying to do something with the evidence we already have.

635
00:45:52,000 --> 00:46:03,000
I'm a chemist, but for a very much interested in this theory, I find a little confusing if the apparent needs for cites,

636
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:14,000
and the theoretical cites in order to bring across this method from the people in capital letters to that lay people.

637
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:16,000
Why is there need for this?

638
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:17,000
What do you mean by that?

639
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:21,000
What do you mean by this mystical...

640
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:28,000
This is forgiving the things which are something so peculiar to the air of California?

641
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:36,000
Because if you are the individual with which this term is to be drawn to us,

642
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:42,000
some of these rather curious stuff in there are completely different.

643
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:47,000
Well, you see, like Dan said, we are not kind of selling anything.

644
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:50,000
We don't care whether anybody believes in trying saucers or not.

645
00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:58,000
And in fact, I've just seen more than two, and the people that have come out of my place who want to do even trying saucers.

646
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:04,000
This is the thing. There was no reason for this in the first place.

647
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:09,000
No reason for all this controversy or skepticism or anything else.

648
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:14,000
If the government agencies that investigate this thing have openly investigated this,

649
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:18,000
but like everything else, where the people predominate,

650
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:23,000
the person of the people decided this must be kept under security.

651
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:26,000
So, even despite the fact, well, certainly,

652
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:29,000
the thing where the other government knew as much about it as they did,

653
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:31,000
they're not seeking anything from another nation.

654
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:36,000
Every other government on the face of the earth knows as much about flying saucers as the earth government does.

655
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:40,000
You see, they're all over the world. They're not just...

656
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:43,000
Well, does that mean that they do know anything about them?

657
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:46,000
You see, they know as much as they do know about them.

658
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:50,000
I haven't heard that for years. I can't say any stronger. They know what they are.

659
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:51,000
They know how they are.

660
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:53,000
Do they know as much as you do about them?

661
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:56,000
They don't know a few of the things that I know, but then on the other hand,

662
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,000
I don't know some of the things they know.

663
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:01,000
Do they really believe that there are people landing here,

664
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,000
in flying saucers, some other planet?

665
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:05,000
Well, I talked to two brain sources.

666
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:08,000
These postmortem brains are 16 bodies.

667
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:11,000
Now, certainly, the Air Force called them civilian brain sources.

668
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:13,000
These are German brains.

669
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:16,000
They must know the flying saucers existed.

670
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:17,000
These are brains.

671
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:18,000
What are you saying?

672
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,000
Who are these 16 people?

673
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:21,000
Of the face people?

674
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:22,000
Yes.

675
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:23,000
Definitely.

676
00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:25,000
Identifiable or not, sir?

677
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,000
Well, they identified them by the fact that the face of the brain

678
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:31,000
indicated that they were 300 to 500 years old,

679
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:35,000
but in my own field, not under a microscope.

680
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:36,000
That was...

681
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:38,000
That was not only...

682
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:42,000
There we run right back into the same old destination,

683
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:46,000
or life-advancing destination, what counts as the truth.

684
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:50,000
You have been told by two brain sources that they did this thing,

685
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:54,000
and thus until everyone found their pendant,

686
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:58,000
and you have to take that on their face, though.

687
00:48:58,000 --> 00:48:59,000
Yes, sir.

688
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:02,000
Everybody else has to take your statement,

689
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:05,000
or men's statement, or a dancing statement,

690
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:08,000
as to contact.

691
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:09,000
That's right.

692
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:14,000
But as I say, if this hadn't been started under a security measure,

693
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:18,000
as something happens in the world rather than in nature,

694
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,000
if something happens in nature, then I believe it is privilege

695
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:24,000
to withhold it from nature, from other nature,

696
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:28,000
if they feel that it is definitely for their own security.

697
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,000
Do you know the name of these brain sources?

698
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:31,000
No, I don't.

699
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,000
Is this name available?

700
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:34,000
No, they're not available.

701
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:36,000
You can't say you've talked to them?

702
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:37,000
I've talked to them, yes.

703
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:38,000
And you don't know them at the time?

704
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:40,000
I was not concerned with their names.

705
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,000
To both the non-cubic cells.

706
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:43,000
They intermixed themselves, and they gave their names,

707
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:46,000
and my wife talked to them, and I have witnessed that they talked to them.

708
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:47,000
And they gave their names?

709
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,000
They gave their names, and they talked to them for two hours,

710
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:53,000
and I have witnessed this with the fact that they said what I just said.

711
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,000
So both of you didn't know me, and I walked into your place

712
00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:59,000
out of Giant Rock Airport, you know?

713
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:02,000
And I said, my name is Joe Blow, I'm a brain surgeon.

714
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:05,000
Did you believe that?

715
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:09,000
I would believe it if you talked in terms of brain surgery

716
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:11,000
that made sense in my reading.

717
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:12,000
Yes.

718
00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:14,000
So both of you, I had a little medical background.

719
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:16,000
Two or three years of medicine.

720
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:17,000
Oh, okay.

721
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:18,000
Possibly I would have someone.

722
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:22,000
You know, when you're trying, you see, when anybody tries to offer you to John,

723
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:26,000
that's your failure, right there, because when I try to offer you to,

724
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:30,000
you reject it on the basis of the fact that you're trying to pass the proof to John.

725
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:32,000
I'm open for it.

726
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:38,000
This is W-O-R Radio, your station in New York.

727
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:43,000
This is Long John with the party line, 710 on your dial.

728
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:49,000
Now once again with the party line, my guest this morning, George Van Cassell.

729
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:55,000
Dan Fry, Dan Fry's the man that claims that he was an applying doctor,

730
00:50:55,000 --> 00:51:00,000
took a trip from the White Sands Proving Ground in New Mexico to New York and back

731
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:03,000
in a period of thirty-three minutes.

732
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:10,000
Han Stephens Anderson is with us this morning, the editorial director of Fantastic Universe.

733
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:16,000
And I'd like to remind you people on the party line who are interested in Flying Saucers,

734
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:24,000
that the current edition of Fantastic Universe, dated August, can fail at your newsstand,

735
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:28,000
has two excellent articles about Flying Saucers.

736
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:32,000
It'll give you both sides of the Flying Saucers question.

737
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:39,000
The one article is written by Ivan Sanderson, who's been a guest on the program many times.

738
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:44,000
It's entitled, UFO, Friend or Fall.

739
00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:52,000
The other article is written by Lester Del Ray, entitled, The Flying Saucer Myth.

740
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:57,000
We also have with us another author of many Flying Saucer books,

741
00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:07,000
Morty Jessup, in his most recent book, is the expanding case for the UFOs.

742
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:15,000
I'd like to get back, George, to that discussion that we were in at the time that we had to do a little business,

743
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:18,000
have to make a buck once in a while, you know.

744
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:27,000
It seems to me that he made this statement that I was not willing to accept truth when it's given to me.

745
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:28,000
Is that right?

746
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:34,000
Well, I told you something had happened, John, and because I couldn't possibly even name the two men,

747
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:38,000
at the time they told me this thing, I wasn't interested in saucer research.

748
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:44,000
We were conducting a research on something entirely different, and I had nothing to do with Flying Saucers.

749
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:48,000
Is this prior to the time that you had received telepathic communications from other planets?

750
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:49,000
No.

751
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:53,000
But I wasn't interested in saucers as a research.

752
00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:58,000
In other words, we were having experience in doing certain things ourselves,

753
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:02,000
and we didn't know that this was something that whole groups would be doing,

754
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:06,000
or that controversies would arise over anything else.

755
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:12,000
To us at the time, it was just a little incident to take place every day, as real as anything else,

756
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:20,000
and nothing to expect you to question people about, or keep a record of everybody who talked to you and found the place.

757
00:53:20,000 --> 00:53:26,000
We run a public air force, it's even 300 to 500 people a week, and we can't write down every conversation we have.

758
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:30,000
Well, did these two doctors arrive at your airport in a plane?

759
00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:32,000
No, they drove.

760
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:38,000
This must have been a very exciting day for you.

761
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:45,000
When you first came to the airport, they were going to tell you about 16 operations that they performed.

762
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:52,000
Well, contrary to being exciting, it was very dull, because I had so much information prior to that,

763
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:57,000
that was only just further evidence in my book.

764
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,000
Are there information on that?

765
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:00,000
Further evidence.

766
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:01,000
I was just further evidence.

767
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:03,000
So, you ran into that at the time in this field?

768
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:12,000
Well, I wasn't interested to the extent that I wanted to write down their names, or keep a record of anything that they said.

769
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:15,000
I had witnessed it as they said it, that's the defense decision.

770
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:16,000
Yeah.

771
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:18,000
For any purpose, right?

772
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:22,000
I have no idea that we're discussing it over the air, or probably anything else.

773
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:24,000
No, I couldn't have done that.

774
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:27,000
This controversy seems to hinge on the fact that no names were given.

775
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:32,000
I don't see where the truth will be any more complete if names can be given.

776
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:33,000
The names I think...

777
00:54:33,000 --> 00:54:37,000
Well, I mean, if you had the names, you could call two names tonight.

778
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:40,000
What did this improve for that?

779
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:42,000
Well, I think it would improve this.

780
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:48,000
In other words, if you mentioned the names of two great brain surgeons, possibly I wouldn't recognize their names,

781
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:50,000
but no doubt some of our listeners.

782
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:56,000
We have many doctors that listen to the program, and they possibly would want to talk to these two brain surgeons,

783
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,000
and get some of this information.

784
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:00,000
I think it's very exciting right now.

785
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:04,000
Well, it was not, but what when they were called in, they were called in under security.

786
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:07,000
But this gave the balls this information.

787
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:11,000
I think they figured we were out in the middle of nowhere, and we knew about this thing,

788
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:16,000
and they came and discussed with me because they had the something off their chest for somebody.

789
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:18,000
That's the way out. That's the way out of the...

790
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:21,000
Do you feel their picture more or less of random?

791
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:25,000
We have many prominent people come to us and discuss this subject,

792
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:28,000
because they feel that they can unload some burden they're carrying,

793
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:31,000
with some strange experiences happening to them.

794
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:33,000
Well, did they have a strange experience?

795
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:37,000
In other words, had these two doctors, did they make the statement to you,

796
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:41,000
that they had also received telepathic communications,

797
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:44,000
or actually ever talked to a person from another planet?

798
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:50,000
No, but they did say that before, they examined the brain, but the dentist had examined the teeth.

799
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:56,000
And they talked to the dentist, and they said the dentist stated that in 16 bodies,

800
00:55:56,000 --> 00:56:00,000
there was no evidence of either decay or repair of the teeth.

801
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:03,000
And they said that naturally with Starling and Gillim,

802
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:10,000
and it was quite scarling to find out that they were running a post-mortem on brains of people from some other planet.

803
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:12,000
Maybe they got fluoridated water on the other planet.

804
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:16,000
And chances are these two men were under security.

805
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:22,000
At the time, if not still, this word security, this thing that keeps things secret,

806
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:27,000
is one of the most dangerous things that can happen in a free country.

807
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:33,000
Because behind that curtain of security, the very forces that we are against,

808
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:38,000
the evil destructive forces that take over governments, are operating.

809
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:41,000
Well, I don't know that half of it.

810
00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:46,000
Well, I maintain that this subject should be brought out to the iron security.

811
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:48,000
Well, we're trying to do that tonight.

812
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:52,000
It is not anything that concerns the defense of this name.

813
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:56,000
I don't think they're all perfectly willing to bring this up.

814
00:56:56,000 --> 00:56:59,000
I don't know in the Vanuuto case. I don't know the names of the names.

815
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:00,000
In the what?

816
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:01,000
Vanuuto.

817
00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:02,000
In the Vanuuto case.

818
00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:03,000
There's not the meaning of that.

819
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:06,000
Well, that's been often called the LA Times case.

820
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:08,000
The Los Angeles Times case.

821
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:09,000
Oh.

822
00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:11,000
No, but we call it the Vanuuto case.

823
00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:14,000
I happen to be one of the first people to investigate a death.

824
00:57:14,000 --> 00:57:17,000
In 1994, there was a Fickley investigation.

825
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:21,000
And I got into it, the Fickley.

826
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:25,000
I know it wasn't an accident now, but I thought it was a time.

827
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:30,000
Simply because I happen to be the right place the right time.

828
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:38,000
And this man who had had this Vanuuto in town packing for a job with these Los Angeles

829
00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:46,000
Times had caused this man to feel it possibly he was becoming very unbalanced or something.

830
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:52,000
Things that were taking place right in his presence were just not earthly possible.

831
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:59,000
And so he in turn called a friend of his who was a, a, and a post scientist I'm calling

832
00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:07,000
because he did a minister of post science and he's a minister of post science.

833
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,000
I don't call him a minister.

834
00:58:09,000 --> 00:58:10,000
I don't know what you were doing.

835
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:16,000
Well, I mean, was he a, was he a Christian or a Christian or a Christian or a Christian.

836
00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:17,000
Yeah, I'm not a Christian.

837
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:18,000
I'm not a Christian.

838
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:19,000
I'm not a Christian.

839
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:20,000
I'm not a Christian.

840
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:21,000
I'm not a Christian.

841
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:22,000
I'm not a Christian.

842
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:23,000
I'm not a Christian.

843
00:58:23,000 --> 00:58:31,000
And after he heard the story from his friend why he in turn was a very close friend of

844
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:32,000
Frank's.

845
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:35,000
So he, he was trying to get his doctor.

846
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:42,000
So he called Frank and told him that Frank in turn told another party whose house I happened

847
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:43,000
to be at.

848
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:50,000
He was getting into the investigation because that man did most of the investigation of

849
00:58:50,000 --> 00:58:51,000
all kinds of stuff.

850
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:52,000
There's con hat and stories.

851
00:58:52,000 --> 00:58:58,000
And so he and I together immediately made the lunch and appointment with this man in

852
00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:03,000
the LA Times case who I'll call Mr. B.

853
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:08,000
And we went and had lunch with him.

854
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:13,000
We had a phone and invited him to have lunch with us and he was regularly lunching first

855
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:14,000
to talk.

856
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:19,000
But he told us all the things that had happened.

857
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:26,000
And then the next day his wife had begun to think he was a little off the beam and so

858
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:27,000
he had physical evidence.

859
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:32,000
This man had done some things to a metal plate which no human can possibly do.

860
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:35,000
And we got the metal plate and run an analysis on it.

861
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:36,000
What happened to the investigation?

862
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:41,000
Well, as far as I know he's still running around the street and somewhere in the country.

863
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:48,000
Because he came to my place six months after he quit down in Los Angeles.

864
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:49,000
And he had worked with me.

865
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:52,000
In fact, we didn't employ him.

866
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:59,000
This man, Mr. B, referred him to a friend of his who worked for Los Angeles County Defender

867
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:02,000
office in a turn.

868
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:09,000
And in turn he worked by the day out of Petty Cakes for the Los Angeles County Defender

869
01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:10,000
office.

870
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:11,000
There's no documents here.

871
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:12,000
There's no records.

872
01:00:12,000 --> 01:00:13,000
Yeah, that's right.

873
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:17,000
If he was working in the department of physical evidence, he wouldn't have been there.

874
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:18,000
He wouldn't have been there.

875
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:19,000
In fact, he worked there.

876
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:24,000
But if he's been paid for being there, there would be no, well, he didn't have a means

877
01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:28,000
to identify himself by our system.

878
01:00:28,000 --> 01:00:31,000
That's why he was made as a point of getting into the county.

879
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:33,000
Has he been in the rain?

880
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:35,000
Sure, he's in the rain.

881
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:36,000
Has he been in the rain?

882
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:37,000
He's been in the rain.

883
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:39,000
Is there a point of guess of identity here?

884
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,000
I don't know how.

885
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:43,000
He would have had a place of birth and so forth.

886
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:50,000
He'd only landed here up near Barclay, California, and he told these people he was in Venus,

887
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:54,000
and he told the man in the LA Times office he was in Venus.

888
01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:56,000
What did he look like?

889
01:00:56,000 --> 01:01:03,000
Well, he looked like Earth people, except he had a no appearance of a beard or whiskers,

890
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:09,000
which the mayor said they whisked the shavings probably a long time ago, so he had no appearance

891
01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:11,000
of a whiskers or anything like that.

892
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:15,000
He didn't got a razor blade from him, I could go ahead.

893
01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:23,000
He was approximately the same height as our people, and he did phenomenal things,

894
01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:28,000
and his time he was employed there for five weeks, he was living there.

895
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:33,000
And those phenomenal things, physical things, completely cynical things,

896
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:39,000
he used other forces that maybe you and I don't, I mean, a control over the force.

897
01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:46,000
Because he traveled, they gave him a list of names that would normally require days of automobile

898
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:49,000
or hour-surface transfer to get around these places.

899
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:57,000
They were scattered all over Southern California, and he completed the whole round in five hours,

900
01:01:57,000 --> 01:02:03,000
which the distance is covered to get to all these addresses, where all of them said he walked up the door

901
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:08,000
and they finally ripped or whatever these presented them with.

902
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:14,000
This particular phenomenal thing that seemed to be one thing, of course the same thing happened back

903
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:20,000
in the Greek times, and they named the man the Greek god, the Mercury, because they fixed

904
01:02:20,000 --> 01:02:23,000
a few wings on the feet, because he could get around.

905
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:28,000
It's the same condition we used that Howard Manger described, he post-saving the belt,

906
01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:35,000
he's anti-gravity belt, or gravity nullifying belt, where he could just step off the ground and take off,

907
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:39,000
and he could be in Santa Ana and nothing flat, apparently was.

908
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:45,000
Because of course he covered it with approximately 300,000 miles, he completed it in five hours,

909
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:46,000
and he got 20 figures.

910
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:51,000
I don't mean to, so that does, it's an expression he does, I know that,

911
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:53,000
because the authorities were called in to investigate it.

912
01:02:53,000 --> 01:03:01,000
I don't mean to express any doubt, but you know, gravity belts are something, it's an old-time and science fiction.

913
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:07,000
That's right, for science fiction, you might have to give these ideas, you know, are they already existed?

914
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:12,000
So is the government, or is the government, the only oldest kind of fiction fiction?

915
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:17,000
Well, yes, of course, the first to set the name, Dave's section, shows the science fiction,

916
01:03:17,000 --> 01:03:21,000
but I'm talking about more recent, the Boletaria and the gravity belt, and the Bible.

917
01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:25,000
Well, that's an indication that there's a certain lapse of time between science fiction and facts.

918
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:29,000
Yes, that's what John, the point we're doing, is the first to set the line.

919
01:03:29,000 --> 01:03:33,000
And when you come to understand time, you can see why there's a lapse.

920
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:39,000
What age, how long did this man say that he couldn't live done being there?

921
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:40,000
There's a count of years.

922
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:46,000
I didn't, I didn't discuss with this man.

923
01:03:46,000 --> 01:03:53,000
This man, when he came to my place, he came in in the middle of a large meeting with the whole east,

924
01:03:53,000 --> 01:03:59,000
and there were twenty-three people in the room at the time we got him,

925
01:03:59,000 --> 01:04:04,000
disappeared and reappeared three times in front of us to show how he could do it.

926
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:08,000
I had twenty-three witnesses to ask, but he drove a Cadillac into the place,

927
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:13,000
and he had another man and two women with him, although none of the others ever spoke,

928
01:04:13,000 --> 01:04:16,000
and never said a word until the time they arrived where they left.

929
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:24,000
I suppose you're aware that a term to read here, which doesn't necessarily imply a physical person in a room,

930
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:29,000
is something which a lot of Indian mystics outside of this would be able to lengthwise do.

931
01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:31,000
But I've never seen one yet they could do it.

932
01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:39,000
Well, but I mean, the point, but the point is, the biggest bunch of fakers in this country are these people of claim they can do something.

933
01:04:39,000 --> 01:04:44,000
Yes, but I've never found one yet they can do it, including these people who can handle things.

934
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:52,000
They can contact the same people with infrared and solar red and infrared and all kinds of gadgets.

935
01:04:52,000 --> 01:04:54,000
I've never seen one of them in contact.

936
01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:59,000
No, but I mean, this question of appearing and disappearing in a room,

937
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:03,000
I've seen that very simply, is not the answer.

938
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:08,000
I know that when he was invisible he was just as solid and I could see him just as thin as I could see.

939
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:09,000
He was?

940
01:05:09,000 --> 01:05:10,000
He was.

941
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:11,000
He was quite solid.

942
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:12,000
He was still there.

943
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:14,000
He was solid and I could see him.

944
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:15,000
Uh huh.

945
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:19,000
Uh, did you want to go ahead and ask George Van Passellis?

946
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:29,000
He wasn't being done a little bit inconsistent when we criticized the people's claim in contact they were.

947
01:05:29,000 --> 01:05:36,000
Once the red rays are likely to reach some of these other means of communication,

948
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:43,000
those have been put well advertised, and it's recognized the patients of these people.

949
01:05:43,000 --> 01:05:45,000
I didn't deny them.

950
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:52,000
I said I have never seen one of them yet, but one, for me, I was plenty of them, my believe it, gadgets.

951
01:05:52,000 --> 01:05:56,000
When I asked him, show me, let's be at work, none of them are ever worth.

952
01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:57,000
They've never made a contact.

953
01:05:57,000 --> 01:06:04,000
May I take a moment, I think you brought up the word gadgets.

954
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:19,000
I have a letter here from Howard E. Jensen, the chairman of the Department of Sociology and Anthropology at Duke University, located in Durham, North Carolina.

955
01:06:19,000 --> 01:06:25,000
I know that Dr. Jensen has listened to the program many times, and this is Jensen.

956
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:27,000
I received a letter from him.

957
01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:29,000
This letter is not addressed to me.

958
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:35,000
This is addressed to a gentleman who just met the female Jew of St. Germain.

959
01:06:35,000 --> 01:06:43,000
And I thought an old friend of yours might want to comment on this as far as gadgets are concerned.

960
01:06:43,000 --> 01:06:51,000
The letter is addressed to Mr. Jew of St. Germain, care of Long John, station W. O. Y. New York, New York, here, sir.

961
01:06:51,000 --> 01:07:00,000
Last night my wife picked up the Long John program and heard your expose of George Vantassel, Howard M. J. and others.

962
01:07:00,000 --> 01:07:06,000
I think that Dr. Jensen has returned to the H. O. Pickles at the particular night.

963
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:19,000
And he goes on to say, it seems to me that if, as my wife reports, Vantassel is requesting aid for his rejuvenating experiment

964
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:32,000
by holding out rejuvenating promises to playboy millionaires on the grounds that he has already succeeded in rejuvenating worse with lower organism,

965
01:07:32,000 --> 01:07:41,000
he could and could be prosecuted by the Postal Authority for using the males to defraud.

966
01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:52,000
This movement would appear to be a gigantic hope which constitutes a great mental health menace to hundreds of thousands of persons.

967
01:07:52,000 --> 01:08:00,000
And on that ground alone should be under the close scrutiny of federal and state and legal authorities.

968
01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:08,000
I am not in favor of censorship of ideas, speech and publications, no matter how fantastic.

969
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:21,000
But where there are antisocial possibilities, as there seem to be in this movement, there should be legal action, prompt and vigorous,

970
01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:28,000
wherever the slightest legal evidence of using the males to defraud can be shown.

971
01:08:29,000 --> 01:08:35,000
The final paragraph is where a commercial evidence was gentlemen listening to the man that brought it,

972
01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:40,000
that I have never asked for any money from anybody for rejuvenation of anything.

973
01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:47,000
I have never asked for money anywhere, at any time I'm in program, in any of my lectures or any other time.

974
01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:54,000
I have been asked a question a number of times as to what it would cost for a particular building or a particular...

975
01:08:55,000 --> 01:09:03,000
And I have answered what the approximate cost would be, but I have never requested at any time from anybody, any money for anything.

976
01:09:03,000 --> 01:09:14,000
Any money that is donated for the work we're doing is donated by people who feel that we're doing something because they've come and investigated it on their own

977
01:09:14,000 --> 01:09:18,000
and made a contribution toward anything we're doing.

978
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:23,000
And like I say, we've got evidence we're doing something, you know, a physical nature.

979
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:27,000
We are not running around the country promoting money for anything.

980
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:32,000
No, the reason I like promoting believers and flying saucers, we don't care whether they believe or not.

981
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:39,000
George, the reason I bring this letter up is due to the fact that he's just incomming on gadgets,

982
01:09:39,000 --> 01:09:43,000
such as green ray, red ray, infrared ray and things like that.

983
01:09:43,000 --> 01:09:52,000
And you felt that there possibly these things did not exist as far as methods of communicating with other planets because you've seen no evidence of it.

984
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:55,000
In other words, no one has ever shown it to you.

985
01:09:55,000 --> 01:10:01,000
Now, is it true then that when people are interested in the possibilities of this machine,

986
01:10:01,000 --> 01:10:11,000
you showed me some photographs of three, I'll have to reply the same terms gadgets are used and they're put together and they create this re-ubinating machine.

987
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:20,000
Have you ever showed this machine, have you ever demonstrated this machine to the people who may be interested in it?

988
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:26,000
No, for the simple reason that this particular machine that this has, has a zero-phase,

989
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:29,000
they do this in it to integrate anything put into it.

990
01:10:29,000 --> 01:10:34,000
Unfortunately, I do not understand that terminology. Could you explain that to me?

991
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:40,000
I can't explain it to you because I'm dealing with a client that our client knows nothing about.

992
01:10:40,000 --> 01:10:45,000
I'm not dealing with anything electronically, so I can't use electronic terms.

993
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:49,000
I have to use the terms that fit the conditions.

994
01:10:49,000 --> 01:10:58,000
And all I'm looking at is not the rejuvenation thing. The thing I showed you the pictures of has nothing to do with the rejuvenation.

995
01:10:58,000 --> 01:11:01,000
Oh, I'm sorry, I thought that that was a miniature machine.

996
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:08,000
The apparatus that was for the rejuvenation, I said, works on a primary energy principle.

997
01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:15,000
And this was a mirrors we could come to without building the change of device that's changed into the lines of force.

998
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:22,000
This is a mirrors we can do anything in towards that line. Where's what we call the Earth's magnetic change?

999
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:24,000
This is a secondary energy.

1000
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:33,000
I would like to point out at this point, the first to be another case where a person is often in an opinion,

1001
01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:48,000
in a rather infallible way about something that they admit they know nothing about.

1002
01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:54,000
There's no evidence in this letter, whatever, that the writer of this letter has ever investigated any part.

1003
01:11:54,000 --> 01:12:02,000
I perhaps should be taking part in this because it has nothing to do with me, but I can't help but point out the fact that this is another case where the writer,

1004
01:12:02,000 --> 01:12:10,000
obviously, believes so strongly in his own opinion that he feels is no necessary to supplement that opinion with any investigation.

1005
01:12:10,000 --> 01:12:14,000
Well, is the machine available for investigation?

1006
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:26,000
I see the letter is written with the intent of putting a propaganda thought into people's minds to prosecute me as a mental hazard.

1007
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:32,000
That's what the letter is written for. It does that very thing. It suggests that everything should be done.

1008
01:12:32,000 --> 01:12:40,000
This is the menace of the same people that are working behind security to take over this country.

1009
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:42,000
Who are those people?

1010
01:12:42,000 --> 01:12:43,000
Who are the people?

1011
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:46,000
Who are those people who are working to take over the country?

1012
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:50,000
How do you know who they are? They're hidden behind the word called security.

1013
01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:56,000
I don't know who they are, but you are referring to them.

1014
01:12:56,000 --> 01:12:59,000
You're implying that they are behind this attempt to...

1015
01:12:59,000 --> 01:13:01,000
No, I don't say they're behind this letter.

1016
01:13:01,000 --> 01:13:04,000
This is equivalent.

1017
01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:08,000
Or this letter signed by Howard E. Genson.

1018
01:13:08,000 --> 01:13:10,000
This man has never come and talked to me.

1019
01:13:10,000 --> 01:13:15,000
You don't know why I should even mention my name in a letter such as this without even listening.

1020
01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:19,000
Without at least trying to find out who I am.

1021
01:13:19,000 --> 01:13:22,000
He is listening to the program.

1022
01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:27,000
Now, he says this movement would appear to be a gigantic host.

1023
01:13:27,000 --> 01:13:30,000
Now, it's only a... What appears to be a gigantic host?

1024
01:13:30,000 --> 01:13:33,000
The only host on this program is the H. H. Ilpiches.

1025
01:13:33,000 --> 01:13:35,000
They are confessed to hosts.

1026
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:42,000
I don't know any of their hosts, but this man implies that it seems to me that if...

1027
01:13:42,000 --> 01:13:46,000
has my wife's report... Now, is he talking with his wife's report?

1028
01:13:46,000 --> 01:13:50,000
The man passed away requesting aid for his rejuvenation experiment.

1029
01:13:50,000 --> 01:13:52,000
Now, I don't know where he gets the idea of requesting aid.

1030
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:56,000
There's no status of any such request at all.

1031
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:03,000
Finally, a moment, Julie, would you just come over here a moment, maybe you have more knowledge of...

1032
01:14:03,000 --> 01:14:09,000
Says here that he has already succeeded in rejuvenating work with lower organs.

1033
01:14:09,000 --> 01:14:13,000
I didn't say I had succeeded in rejuvenating work with lower organs.

1034
01:14:13,000 --> 01:14:20,000
Well, I think he was referring rather to the lizards.

1035
01:14:20,000 --> 01:14:25,000
He could and should be prosecuted by the postal authorities for using the mail to be fraud.

1036
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:32,000
Well, now there he is suggesting something that he knows will be brought out of the air.

1037
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:36,000
Why should I be prosecuted by the postal authorities for using the mail to be fraud?

1038
01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:38,000
I'm not asking anybody for anything.

1039
01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:44,000
Well, in all fairness, I have never had the pleasure of talking with Dr. Jensen.

1040
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:46,000
And you know the letter is not addressed to me.

1041
01:14:46,000 --> 01:14:48,000
No, that's the best you can do, Julie.

1042
01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:51,000
It's the name. It's addressed to the man who performs the hoax, not to me.

1043
01:14:51,000 --> 01:14:57,000
Have you contacted Mr. Jensen since you received this letter?

1044
01:14:57,000 --> 01:15:01,000
No, as a matter of fact, John, I just saw it.

1045
01:15:01,000 --> 01:15:03,000
Oh, just one of the letters that you just received?

1046
01:15:03,000 --> 01:15:07,000
That is right. I just saw it about ten minutes ago for the first time.

1047
01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:09,000
I thought it might be of interest.

1048
01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:16,000
The deal was the fact that his opinions pretty well coincide with mine.

1049
01:15:16,000 --> 01:15:19,000
Where did he get these opinions?

1050
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:20,000
This program?

1051
01:15:20,000 --> 01:15:24,000
I cannot probe into this gentleman's mind, Mr. Van Hassell.

1052
01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:31,000
I read on the air some months ago, excerpts from the Europe Receiving of the College of Universal Ways.

1053
01:15:31,000 --> 01:15:37,000
I think any normal person to mine would interpret the rest of the statement of yours.

1054
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:40,000
I mean, the rest is just for fun.

1055
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:48,000
I don't know whether there's anything other than on the second page,

1056
01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:53,000
which is the page that the fellow is really responsible for the training and so forth.

1057
01:15:53,000 --> 01:16:00,000
Other proceedings that says something about funds for research are

1058
01:16:00,000 --> 01:16:02,000
essential to keep it going.

1059
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:09,000
Oh, to understand, Mr. Van Hassell, you have a laboratory, a research laboratory, things like construction.

1060
01:16:09,000 --> 01:16:16,000
We have a blueprint about funding, and you are rejuvenating the fund as part of that.

1061
01:16:16,000 --> 01:16:18,000
It'll be in that building.

1062
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:21,000
Well, shall I refresh your recollection of some of your own words?

1063
01:16:21,000 --> 01:16:22,000
Yes, of course.

1064
01:16:22,000 --> 01:16:26,000
Well, just before you do, if you have something there that you want to look up,

1065
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:29,000
here's a bulletin from the WOR newsroom.

1066
01:16:29,000 --> 01:16:36,000
The United States and her allies have nullified the four-year-old Korean Armistice Agreement.

1067
01:16:36,000 --> 01:16:42,000
As I might say, I think Mr. Van Hassell is very clever, even though you use that word.

1068
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:47,000
In his proceedings, avoid the words, please give me money.

1069
01:16:47,000 --> 01:16:53,000
But his periodicals have been so frail that they're implicit in the words that he used.

1070
01:16:53,000 --> 01:16:59,000
A asking for funds, now just as close from his proceedings.

1071
01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:04,000
There's so much of this stuff here talking to take it out of July 1, 1954.

1072
01:17:04,000 --> 01:17:09,000
He refers to the College of Universe and wisdom and purpose.

1073
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:17,000
Among the things I'm quoting now, we've received data about our rejuvenation, extension of the human life span,

1074
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:22,000
electrical energy at no cost, life motors that require no fuel,

1075
01:17:22,000 --> 01:17:28,000
the elimination of requirements for work through the application of free energy mechanisms,

1076
01:17:28,000 --> 01:17:31,000
the elimination of disease from the Earth,

1077
01:17:31,000 --> 01:17:39,000
also the development of conusculpt, tensor scans, crystallic rafts, and other instruments used by the space people.

1078
01:17:39,000 --> 01:17:46,000
With the perfection of any of these, through research, the means to make a new religion will be advanced to the people of our core.

1079
01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:59,000
The College of Research is to your benefit at no cost to humanity except the free contributions you make voluntarily to make these things possible.

1080
01:17:59,000 --> 01:18:02,000
That's the darn good commercial in my opinion.

1081
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:04,000
I think you're a little bit more...

1082
01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:06,000
Let me answer that.

1083
01:18:06,000 --> 01:18:08,000
Let's be fair about this.

1084
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:10,000
I certainly want to be.

1085
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:12,000
That is a statement of fact.

1086
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:18,000
There's no saying there that naturally anything you do today requires the money to do it.

1087
01:18:18,000 --> 01:18:20,000
Well, then you are asking for money, aren't you?

1088
01:18:20,000 --> 01:18:22,000
No, I'm not asking for it.

1089
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:25,000
I only stated that it was necessary for the purpose.

1090
01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:27,000
And what is the indication?

1091
01:18:27,000 --> 01:18:29,000
The people are contributing.

1092
01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:32,000
It only indicates I'm stating that money for the purpose is necessary.

1093
01:18:32,000 --> 01:18:34,000
I didn't ask for anything.

1094
01:18:34,000 --> 01:18:40,000
You are stating such facts as rejuvenation, such facts as longevity of life,

1095
01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:44,000
and I might take a little exception to be a quality fact.

1096
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:46,000
Submit me to.

1097
01:18:46,000 --> 01:18:50,000
And then at the end, oh, very subtly, Mr. Mancato, very subtly,

1098
01:18:50,000 --> 01:19:03,000
the College of Research is to your benefit at no cost to humanity except the free contributions you make voluntarily to make these things possible.

1099
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:06,000
I say again, sir, that is a kiss and a clever kiss.

1100
01:19:06,000 --> 01:19:15,000
Is that any difference in a preacher asking for a little collection to maintain the church or anything that is required by contribution?

1101
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:18,000
A moment ago you were saying you were asking for no contribution.

1102
01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:21,000
Now you're drawing an analogy to the preacher.

1103
01:19:21,000 --> 01:19:22,000
No, I said that.

1104
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:24,000
You're blowing a hot and cold in the same dress.

1105
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:28,000
I said that the contribution is necessary to maintain the research.

1106
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:30,000
We operate by contribution.

1107
01:19:30,000 --> 01:19:33,000
Then you are asking for contributions, aren't you?

1108
01:19:33,000 --> 01:19:35,000
A moment ago you said you were not.

1109
01:19:35,000 --> 01:19:36,000
I don't think so.

1110
01:19:36,000 --> 01:19:37,000
Could I interject?

1111
01:19:37,000 --> 01:19:38,000
Go ahead, Dan.

1112
01:19:38,000 --> 01:19:44,000
I think the statement here merely indicates that if there are no contributions, there can be no research.

1113
01:19:44,000 --> 01:19:49,000
I don't think this could be safely implied as a request.

1114
01:19:49,000 --> 01:19:51,000
It is, as you said, a statement of fact.

1115
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:55,000
If there are contributions, there can be research if there are no contributions.

1116
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:56,000
That can't be the question.

1117
01:19:56,000 --> 01:19:59,000
One of the most important investment requests to anyone to join the conversation.

1118
01:19:59,000 --> 01:20:02,000
Let me ask one question, Mr. Mancato.

1119
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:09,000
In your proceeding, which paraphrasing a remark of yours earlier,

1120
01:20:09,000 --> 01:20:13,000
same thing enough, some of us don't see over here too often,

1121
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:22,000
in your proceeding, do you report regularly on the researchers that you are conducting?

1122
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:24,000
Do I report regularly on them?

1123
01:20:24,000 --> 01:20:27,000
Do you report on the research that you are conducting?

1124
01:20:27,000 --> 01:20:34,000
Do I report anything with diagrams, details or proofs?

1125
01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:36,000
Anything of a proven nature?

1126
01:20:36,000 --> 01:20:38,000
Yeah, we are not going to...

1127
01:20:38,000 --> 01:20:41,000
Anything of an attempt to prove a nature, you mean,

1128
01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:46,000
in any stage of its operation, anything of an assumedly proven nature, you mean?

1129
01:20:46,000 --> 01:20:54,000
I mean, well, I mean that anything that we definitely know we can back up

1130
01:20:54,000 --> 01:21:00,000
with the rejuvenation of the lizard, to be an example of what it is in defenitonation of the lizard.

1131
01:21:00,000 --> 01:21:05,000
Well, matching the head in and then having the head grow back, is that the story?

1132
01:21:05,000 --> 01:21:07,000
The head doesn't grow back.

1133
01:21:07,000 --> 01:21:08,000
Have you photographed?

1134
01:21:08,000 --> 01:21:10,000
What's wrong with growing this?

1135
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:12,000
I showed Long John some photographs.

1136
01:21:12,000 --> 01:21:13,000
I haven't been with him tonight.

1137
01:21:13,000 --> 01:21:15,000
There's only a picture of this small...

1138
01:21:15,000 --> 01:21:17,000
I don't accept that he sees one of them.

1139
01:21:17,000 --> 01:21:19,000
I don't know what he's doing with the lizard.

1140
01:21:19,000 --> 01:21:20,000
I don't see it.

1141
01:21:20,000 --> 01:21:22,000
Yeah, I guess two moments later you'll see.

1142
01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:25,000
It is very true that...

1143
01:21:25,000 --> 01:21:27,000
I forget which morning it was at this point.

1144
01:21:27,000 --> 01:21:31,000
I think it was Wednesday morning.

1145
01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:41,000
George had a number of photographs here, and one group of photographs showed three...

1146
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:46,000
And pardon me if I use this term, gadgets, the only way I can describe it.

1147
01:21:46,000 --> 01:21:47,000
Three pieces of equipment.

1148
01:21:47,000 --> 01:21:49,000
Three pieces of equipment.

1149
01:21:49,000 --> 01:21:58,000
And he also had a 12-inch square next to it so that you can get a little idea of the size of these pieces of equipment.

1150
01:21:58,000 --> 01:22:11,000
George also mentioned that they were not put together in their proper fashion so that anybody seeing the photographs would not know how this machine would function.

1151
01:22:11,000 --> 01:22:12,000
Isn't that true?

1152
01:22:12,000 --> 01:22:13,000
In other words, they were separate.

1153
01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:23,000
But the only way I could say is if we wanted to show a lead pencil, you'd have some graphite, and you'd have some wood over here, and you'd say,

1154
01:22:23,000 --> 01:22:25,000
eventually I'll make something that I can write with.

1155
01:22:25,000 --> 01:22:27,000
Well, when I put these together...

1156
01:22:27,000 --> 01:22:29,000
There were four pieces of equipment.

1157
01:22:29,000 --> 01:22:31,000
Each one was built up out of three.

1158
01:22:31,000 --> 01:22:35,000
No, there were four, and each one was built up out of other pieces.

1159
01:22:35,000 --> 01:22:36,000
Yes, I realized that.

1160
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:38,000
They were built up pieces of equipment.

1161
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:40,000
Now, can I contribute that?

1162
01:22:40,000 --> 01:22:43,000
Life is skeptical, no care.

1163
01:22:43,000 --> 01:22:46,000
I'm a research worker in addition to being an editor.

1164
01:22:46,000 --> 01:23:04,000
If you showed me these pictures, and on the back there were notations by an independent witness saying that I testify notarized notations saying I've testified that at 105, this was the physical appearance of the lizard.

1165
01:23:04,000 --> 01:23:08,000
The next picture I testified at 115.

1166
01:23:08,000 --> 01:23:10,000
I testified at 125.

1167
01:23:10,000 --> 01:23:16,000
I think I would be completely receptive.

1168
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:19,000
These pictures were only taken to bring back years still along the aisle.

1169
01:23:19,000 --> 01:23:25,000
Well, but you see, you can understand that in the absence of...

1170
01:23:25,000 --> 01:23:28,000
I have witnesses that have seen these things work.

1171
01:23:28,000 --> 01:23:30,000
I don't need to write on the back of a picture.

1172
01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:32,000
Could you tell us something about the witnesses?

1173
01:23:32,000 --> 01:23:34,000
I do, could write.

1174
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:35,000
I'm suggesting the witnesses.

1175
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:37,000
I haven't their addresses with me.

1176
01:23:37,000 --> 01:23:39,000
Could you tell us the name?

1177
01:23:39,000 --> 01:23:41,000
One of them is named Zarno.

1178
01:23:41,000 --> 01:23:43,000
Yes.

1179
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:48,000
Two of his friends who I don't recall their names because my association was not with them.

1180
01:23:48,000 --> 01:23:50,000
Are they the only witnesses?

1181
01:23:50,000 --> 01:23:53,000
No, there are several of their wives.

1182
01:23:53,000 --> 01:23:56,000
Any other men's wives?

1183
01:23:56,000 --> 01:23:58,000
Yes, there are other people.

1184
01:23:58,000 --> 01:24:02,000
May I make a suggestion, George, for our listeners?

1185
01:24:02,000 --> 01:24:06,000
Because there are many nights that they're not with us on the program.

1186
01:24:06,000 --> 01:24:10,000
And after all, we just started the program back in August.

1187
01:24:10,000 --> 01:24:12,000
And we were only on the air for two or three months.

1188
01:24:12,000 --> 01:24:15,000
That is the last time that you appeared on the program.

1189
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:21,000
I wonder if you'd be kind enough and a specific brief outline of what happened on the desert

1190
01:24:21,000 --> 01:24:24,000
when you found the two lizards with the crushed heads.

1191
01:24:24,000 --> 01:24:26,000
What happened when I found them?

1192
01:24:26,000 --> 01:24:28,000
Well, you handled it anyway.

1193
01:24:28,000 --> 01:24:30,000
Well, we didn't find them.

1194
01:24:30,000 --> 01:24:35,000
In fact, most of this research was conducted by this man, Donald, who was an associate.

1195
01:24:35,000 --> 01:24:37,000
He's got his last name on here.

1196
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:39,000
Yes, his last name.

1197
01:24:39,000 --> 01:24:49,000
And the lizard head was smashed against a venture table or something.

1198
01:24:49,000 --> 01:24:51,000
Was this done intentionally?

1199
01:24:51,000 --> 01:24:52,000
Yes.

1200
01:24:52,000 --> 01:24:53,000
To conduct the investigation?

1201
01:24:53,000 --> 01:24:55,000
No, it was done intentionally.

1202
01:24:55,000 --> 01:25:00,000
Well, don't mind me asking the question, George, because I'm not too familiar with the story at this point.

1203
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:13,000
The only thing is that we found out in this research that if this time phase exceeded the differential of this field,

1204
01:25:13,000 --> 01:25:16,000
that the lizard would completely disintegrate.

1205
01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:24,000
And so we demonstrated again that the very forces which we can heat ourselves with can also burn it.

1206
01:25:24,000 --> 01:25:34,000
And in other words, this particular field not only assembles the atomic structure of the head and makes it well again,

1207
01:25:34,000 --> 01:25:38,000
but if you don't get him out of there in the right time, right, it won't be anything less of it.

1208
01:25:38,000 --> 01:25:48,000
So we've held a lot of this information for that reason, because we're dealing with a force that's greater than atomic energy

1209
01:25:48,000 --> 01:25:52,000
as prior to atomic energy, and even atoms are born from it.

1210
01:25:53,000 --> 01:25:54,000
Prior?

1211
01:25:54,000 --> 01:25:56,000
Prior to atomic energy?

1212
01:25:56,000 --> 01:25:57,000
Yes.

1213
01:25:57,000 --> 01:25:59,000
The force in which atoms are born.

1214
01:25:59,000 --> 01:26:01,000
Oh, I see atoms on the moon.

1215
01:26:01,000 --> 01:26:05,000
For science, what happens to the heads of the lizard before it would be a story?

1216
01:26:05,000 --> 01:26:10,000
Precisely what happens is that every atom is like a person.

1217
01:26:10,000 --> 01:26:15,000
It's intelligent to understand, and knows its purpose as an element.

1218
01:26:15,000 --> 01:26:22,000
And as all of the people who left that lecture tonight knew their way home without having to ask anybody,

1219
01:26:22,000 --> 01:26:26,000
when these atoms are dispersed in the crushing of the head,

1220
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:33,000
if they are permitted to be removed from all forces, which tends to hold them apart,

1221
01:26:33,000 --> 01:26:37,000
they will immediately reassemble themselves into what they would call home,

1222
01:26:37,000 --> 01:26:40,000
or the last position they knew when they were aged.

1223
01:26:40,000 --> 01:26:44,000
Which is a quarry that they would call a factory in the morning.

1224
01:26:44,000 --> 01:26:46,000
Anyway, that's what takes place.

1225
01:26:46,000 --> 01:26:49,000
Yeah, well, the reason to face it is for the man who will tell us to understand,

1226
01:26:49,000 --> 01:26:55,000
so you all are without too descriptive words, you smash in the head of the lizard,

1227
01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:59,000
you put it under machine, it causes the earth to be under certain conditions,

1228
01:26:59,000 --> 01:27:01,000
and the head grows back to normal.

1229
01:27:01,000 --> 01:27:02,000
And the head grows back to normal.

1230
01:27:02,000 --> 01:27:05,000
Now, I may ask you, though, how many witnesses did you have to get?

1231
01:27:05,000 --> 01:27:08,000
Actually, I could stick to seven.

1232
01:27:08,000 --> 01:27:13,000
I don't recall that offhand, but it might have been eight, it might have been twelve.

1233
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:17,000
I just can't recall exactly at the moment,

1234
01:27:17,000 --> 01:27:23,000
because I can kill anybody or take anybody to the witnesses out there,

1235
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:25,000
but I can't present them here.

1236
01:27:25,000 --> 01:27:28,000
Wasn't it true, George, if my memory serves me correctly,

1237
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:34,000
that during the time that you conducted this experiment with the ligus in the crushed head,

1238
01:27:34,000 --> 01:27:39,000
and the rejuvenating machine, that there were two brain specialists there?

1239
01:27:39,000 --> 01:27:46,000
No, no, the two brain specialists only came into my place and told me about the brain-based animals.

1240
01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:50,000
As I must frankly admit to you, I could be wrong,

1241
01:27:50,000 --> 01:27:53,000
but it seems that if my memory serves me correctly,

1242
01:27:53,000 --> 01:27:58,000
that when you were with me last October, that you mentioned that there were two brain specialists at that time,

1243
01:27:58,000 --> 01:28:01,000
and I also asked you the question if you need some help,

1244
01:28:01,000 --> 01:28:05,000
and they were from two major hospitals in the West Coast.

1245
01:28:05,000 --> 01:28:07,000
May I ask this, Mr. Van?

1246
01:28:07,000 --> 01:28:12,000
All these people from out in the West Coast, your witnesses are all out there.

1247
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:16,000
Well, I just want to remind you your memory is very bad.

1248
01:28:16,000 --> 01:28:19,000
I spoke to you at the Pithian Temple when you elected there.

1249
01:28:19,000 --> 01:28:23,000
You told me the name of one of your witnesses, from Chicago,

1250
01:28:23,000 --> 01:28:29,000
another Wayne Wright from Indianapolis, that you couldn't give me the precise address.

1251
01:28:29,000 --> 01:28:32,000
Your story has changed, your memory is very bad.

1252
01:28:32,000 --> 01:28:36,000
Your story has changed, because I don't know any Smith and Chicago.

1253
01:28:36,000 --> 01:28:39,000
I imagine there are a lot of people who don't even know the name.

1254
01:28:39,000 --> 01:28:43,000
Well, in the time when you saw Simon, you might have thought Simon and then turned it into Smith,

1255
01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:45,000
because Simon is a man, not Smith.

1256
01:28:45,000 --> 01:28:49,000
Well, nobody, they're all from the West Coast, you just got a moment ago,

1257
01:28:49,000 --> 01:28:51,000
now in Chicago, you'd be an athlete.

1258
01:28:51,000 --> 01:28:54,000
Well, we as men are working on a equivalent research,

1259
01:28:54,000 --> 01:28:58,000
but they are not witnesses to the thing that I had.

1260
01:28:58,000 --> 01:29:03,000
Well, once again, sir, I say your story has changed, but you've gotten away from change.

1261
01:29:03,000 --> 01:29:05,000
You're getting away from a very basic issue.

1262
01:29:05,000 --> 01:29:12,000
A moment again, you vehemently said you were not asking for contribution for the rejuvenation machine.

1263
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:14,000
Now you're justifying the contribution.

1264
01:29:14,000 --> 01:29:16,000
Now let me just quote again.

1265
01:29:16,000 --> 01:29:22,000
And once again, your language always tries to read your loophole.

1266
01:29:22,000 --> 01:29:26,000
You tell that the property you mentioned here,

1267
01:29:26,000 --> 01:29:29,000
I don't want to read the whole thing about the rejuvenation machine,

1268
01:29:29,000 --> 01:29:33,000
you say, if the building on apparatus are constructed,

1269
01:29:33,000 --> 01:29:39,000
it will require at least a year of research to learn to control it actually on this planet.

1270
01:29:39,000 --> 01:29:42,000
I intend to test it on myself first.

1271
01:29:42,000 --> 01:29:48,000
The property N-8 has illegally assigned to the organization by my wife and myself.

1272
01:29:48,000 --> 01:29:51,000
We have piped water out of the property around the third stage.

1273
01:29:51,000 --> 01:29:55,000
All that is needed now is the building and the apparatus.

1274
01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:59,000
The building will cost approximately $26,000.

1275
01:29:59,000 --> 01:30:05,000
More of this amount is spent continuously by people for things that bring no results.

1276
01:30:05,000 --> 01:30:10,000
The apparatus will cost an additional $20,000 to $30,000.

1277
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:14,000
This is not any expenditure at all for such a benefit to humanity.

1278
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:22,000
Of course, we know there will be plenty of skeptics who have never done anything for anyone else but themselves who will ridicule all this.

1279
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:26,000
The government can appropriate billions for weapons to destroy,

1280
01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:34,000
so we do hope that the government authorities will be interested in financing anything that prolongs human life.

1281
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:37,000
We are not asking for anything.

1282
01:30:37,000 --> 01:30:40,000
We do have, the two is unaligned by you by the way,

1283
01:30:40,000 --> 01:30:43,000
the information to make rejuvenation possible,

1284
01:30:43,000 --> 01:30:48,000
adding 50 to 80 years on the average life plan,

1285
01:30:48,000 --> 01:30:51,000
plus results in a useful vitality.

1286
01:30:51,000 --> 01:30:57,000
Think about it, some of you tired out millionaire playboys and a lot of kids that.

1287
01:30:57,000 --> 01:31:00,000
Do you still don't want contributions Mr. Menzel?

1288
01:31:00,000 --> 01:31:05,000
That is just a sarcastic remark on my part.

1289
01:31:05,000 --> 01:31:08,000
That is not a plug for money.

1290
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:11,000
So as a matter of fact, in every issue you ask for money, don't you?

1291
01:31:11,000 --> 01:31:13,000
No, I don't ask for money.

1292
01:31:13,000 --> 01:31:14,000
Contributions?

1293
01:31:14,000 --> 01:31:19,000
In the front, to the trustees of the organization and so forth,

1294
01:31:19,000 --> 01:31:22,000
we are supported by contributions.

1295
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:24,000
We are the famous church.

1296
01:31:24,000 --> 01:31:27,000
Well, I think a lot of menaces might disagree with you, sir.

1297
01:31:27,000 --> 01:31:29,000
Well, you would disagree with me entirely.

1298
01:31:29,000 --> 01:31:32,000
I don't know what your motive is in this whole thing.

1299
01:31:32,000 --> 01:31:37,000
My motive is to protect people and to avoid fraud being perpetrated on the public,

1300
01:31:37,000 --> 01:31:40,000
which is precisely why I am here tonight.

1301
01:31:40,000 --> 01:31:44,000
I don't think you have to go to Valley California and investigate out where the business is instead of back here.

1302
01:31:44,000 --> 01:31:45,000
Investigate?

1303
01:31:45,000 --> 01:31:46,000
What's going on?

1304
01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:51,000
I asked you at the Kithyan Temple, Mr. Van Cattl, to refresh your records,

1305
01:31:51,000 --> 01:31:56,000
and would you be willing to demonstrate the rejuvenation of a legend

1306
01:31:56,000 --> 01:31:59,000
before disinterested newspaper reporting?

1307
01:31:59,000 --> 01:32:04,000
And this was asked if you had been declining the press for the entire evening

1308
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:06,000
to fail and to give you publicity.

1309
01:32:06,000 --> 01:32:08,000
You said I...

1310
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:11,000
I never condemned the press for not giving you publicity.

1311
01:32:11,000 --> 01:32:12,000
Well, let me finish, please.

1312
01:32:12,000 --> 01:32:15,000
You said that it wouldn't prove anything.

1313
01:32:15,000 --> 01:32:17,000
I wouldn't show this to newspaper reporting.

1314
01:32:17,000 --> 01:32:18,000
That's right.

1315
01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:19,000
Because they wouldn't know what they were seeing when they saw it.

1316
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:21,000
But you would show it to me.

1317
01:32:21,000 --> 01:32:23,000
Pardon me if I don't do words, sir.

1318
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:26,000
I asked you to show it to scientists.

1319
01:32:26,000 --> 01:32:29,000
You said to me, what was that prove?

1320
01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:30,000
It wouldn't prove anything.

1321
01:32:30,000 --> 01:32:31,000
What would it prove?

1322
01:32:31,000 --> 01:32:33,000
Show it to me.

1323
01:32:33,000 --> 01:32:34,000
Would that prove something?

1324
01:32:34,000 --> 01:32:38,000
Yes, there was one I uttered truth in what you were saying.

1325
01:32:38,000 --> 01:32:44,000
Don't you think by the demonstration of the miraculously revived legend,

1326
01:32:44,000 --> 01:32:47,000
you'd have the world convinced if any eminent...

1327
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:49,000
Let me finish, please, sir.

1328
01:32:49,000 --> 01:32:55,000
If any eminent disinterested scientist saw this lizard head throw back in the space,

1329
01:32:55,000 --> 01:32:58,000
don't you think he'd say, this is a wonderful man.

1330
01:32:58,000 --> 01:33:00,000
Don't you think your program would be sold?

1331
01:33:00,000 --> 01:33:04,000
But you'll show it to Smith or Wainwright or...

1332
01:33:04,000 --> 01:33:05,000
I don't know what program.

1333
01:33:05,000 --> 01:33:07,000
But you want to benefit humanity.

1334
01:33:07,000 --> 01:33:08,000
That's right.

1335
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:12,000
Don't you think the government would be glad to help you to finance you in this effort?

1336
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:13,000
Well, I...

1337
01:33:13,000 --> 01:33:16,000
Instead of setting asses for millionaire playboys to help you?

1338
01:33:16,000 --> 01:33:18,000
I didn't ask any millionaire playboys.

1339
01:33:18,000 --> 01:33:20,000
Show me where it asks any millionaire playboys.

1340
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:22,000
You are the implicator in the South Square.

1341
01:33:22,000 --> 01:33:23,000
I will not split here.

1342
01:33:23,000 --> 01:33:25,000
You're going by implication.

1343
01:33:25,000 --> 01:33:26,000
That's your interpretation.

1344
01:33:26,000 --> 01:33:28,000
Well, Mr. Jensen heard me read this.

1345
01:33:28,000 --> 01:33:29,000
He got the...

1346
01:33:29,000 --> 01:33:30,000
I don't know Mr. Jensen.

1347
01:33:30,000 --> 01:33:32,000
I understand that he's a very well-known...

1348
01:33:32,000 --> 01:33:33,000
Well, no.

1349
01:33:33,000 --> 01:33:34,000
He's a sociologist.

1350
01:33:34,000 --> 01:33:35,000
And I am a sociologist.

1351
01:33:35,000 --> 01:33:36,000
I asked...

1352
01:33:36,000 --> 01:33:37,000
I said one thing.

1353
01:33:37,000 --> 01:33:41,000
Oh, Mr. Van Tafel would ask me why I'm here tonight.

1354
01:33:41,000 --> 01:33:46,000
And one of the reasons I'm here is that it remarks be made on Tuesday night,

1355
01:33:46,000 --> 01:33:47,000
I should say, I thought...

1356
01:33:47,000 --> 01:33:53,000
Well, the man may just suggest the jewels, and I hope that you'll accept the suggestion.

1357
01:33:53,000 --> 01:34:02,000
I mentioned to George when he came into town that I'd like to have him on one night with

1358
01:34:02,000 --> 01:34:03,000
jewels.

1359
01:34:03,000 --> 01:34:05,000
And at that time, he made this decision.

1360
01:34:05,000 --> 01:34:07,000
He saw no reason re-hacking the H.O.

1361
01:34:07,000 --> 01:34:08,000
letter.

1362
01:34:08,000 --> 01:34:11,000
And this was his right as a guest.

1363
01:34:11,000 --> 01:34:16,000
In turn, he made some comments because I brought up a question about H.O.

1364
01:34:16,000 --> 01:34:17,000
letter.

1365
01:34:17,000 --> 01:34:20,000
And in turn, as you know, you're in New York all the time.

1366
01:34:20,000 --> 01:34:23,000
You can come on the program any night if you want.

1367
01:34:23,000 --> 01:34:28,000
You happen to stop up here tonight with Ben over here just to say hello.

1368
01:34:28,000 --> 01:34:30,000
This letter was handed to me.

1369
01:34:30,000 --> 01:34:35,000
I read the letter, and then at the moment I became confused because I didn't know whether

1370
01:34:35,000 --> 01:34:39,000
your spoken to and stated may force, and I thought that you could add some additional

1371
01:34:39,000 --> 01:34:40,000
information.

1372
01:34:40,000 --> 01:34:44,000
So, if you will, I don't think we want to talk about H.O.

1373
01:34:44,000 --> 01:34:45,000
letter.

1374
01:34:45,000 --> 01:34:47,000
Well, we don't want to talk about H.O.

1375
01:34:47,000 --> 01:34:48,000
letters.

1376
01:34:48,000 --> 01:34:49,000
Fine.

1377
01:34:49,000 --> 01:34:51,000
We don't want to talk about that he said this.

1378
01:34:51,000 --> 01:34:53,000
He has an opinion of the H.O.

1379
01:34:53,000 --> 01:34:55,000
letters, that he has a right to that opinion.

1380
01:34:55,000 --> 01:34:57,000
I would like to have a discussion.

1381
01:34:57,000 --> 01:34:59,000
You happen to be here now and you're sitting down.

1382
01:34:59,000 --> 01:35:07,000
I think that it would be of interest to George and to Dan and to Arliss me to hear this

1383
01:35:07,000 --> 01:35:09,000
discussion as two gentlemen.

1384
01:35:09,000 --> 01:35:12,000
And I know that both of you are gentlemen.

1385
01:35:12,000 --> 01:35:17,000
So, he commented on what you were trying to accomplish with the H.O.

1386
01:35:17,000 --> 01:35:20,000
letters, and we could take another four hours and read a copy.

1387
01:35:20,000 --> 01:35:24,000
I don't want to be late at the point, you know, but you are not discussing.

1388
01:35:24,000 --> 01:35:28,000
Well, let him have a moment and then if I see it, I'll stop him.

1389
01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:29,000
Believe me, I will.

1390
01:35:29,000 --> 01:35:30,000
Go ahead, George.

1391
01:35:30,000 --> 01:35:32,000
I don't want to be late at the H.O.

1392
01:35:32,000 --> 01:35:33,000
letters.

1393
01:35:33,000 --> 01:35:37,000
In and of themselves, I think they're rather insignificant.

1394
01:35:37,000 --> 01:35:42,000
Their purpose was number one, to show the solitude of the persons with a will

1395
01:35:42,000 --> 01:35:46,000
of belief, and secondly, that in my opinion Mr.

1396
01:35:46,000 --> 01:35:48,000
Vantappan was taking advantage of people.

1397
01:35:48,000 --> 01:35:52,000
However, on the program the other night, there was a reference I met with

1398
01:35:52,000 --> 01:35:57,000
who's made comparing my message to Hitler.

1399
01:35:57,000 --> 01:36:02,000
Now, that is something which I presented very much, one of the reasons I'm here tonight.

1400
01:36:02,000 --> 01:36:08,000
Later on, a statement was made, and I, Mr. Vantappan, thought that I would like to also add, although you're

1401
01:36:08,000 --> 01:36:14,000
welcome any night, you were not invited to the night he talked about that.

1402
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:19,000
He stopped up tonight and this letter was presented to me, and I asked you to come in

1403
01:36:19,000 --> 01:36:21,000
on this letter, right?

1404
01:36:21,000 --> 01:36:27,000
Yes, but you've heard, John, that I, if the reference were made to your message as comparable

1405
01:36:27,000 --> 01:36:30,000
to Hitler, that you might feel a slight retentance?

1406
01:36:30,000 --> 01:36:34,000
Quite true, and don't you think that you're welcome to come on the program tonight?

1407
01:36:34,000 --> 01:36:39,000
Mr. Vantappan commented that I made this statement in his answer.

1408
01:36:39,000 --> 01:36:44,000
I must say, the talk to him fakes the fate, although there were three men there, how

1409
01:36:44,000 --> 01:36:45,000
was that in truth?

1410
01:36:45,000 --> 01:36:48,000
Call upon Haitian to Mr. Lester without a defendant at night.

1411
01:36:48,000 --> 01:36:49,000
That's true.

1412
01:36:49,000 --> 01:36:52,000
Not to the defendant, I don't think exactly.

1413
01:36:52,000 --> 01:36:53,000
He was neutral.

1414
01:36:53,000 --> 01:36:54,000
He was neutral.

1415
01:36:54,000 --> 01:36:55,000
That's true.

1416
01:36:55,000 --> 01:36:58,000
Now, Mr. Vantappan stated this is an amendment.

1417
01:36:58,000 --> 01:37:02,000
I'm saying, no, I don't like to do things with people's answers.

1418
01:37:02,000 --> 01:37:06,000
I like to deal with man's and his place of face to face.

1419
01:37:06,000 --> 01:37:13,000
At the end of the program, Mr. Vantappan made this statement, referring to me, that he

1420
01:37:13,000 --> 01:37:20,000
had better back off while he can, and I'd like to know precisely what he meant by that statement.

1421
01:37:20,000 --> 01:37:22,000
I think I'm quoting the defendant.

1422
01:37:22,000 --> 01:37:26,000
I don't think I could put Mr. Vantappan back off while he can.

1423
01:37:26,000 --> 01:37:29,000
Back off while he can, very desperately.

1424
01:37:29,000 --> 01:37:30,000
Well, I probably did.

1425
01:37:30,000 --> 01:37:31,000
I put it that way.

1426
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:32,000
You sound like me.

1427
01:37:32,000 --> 01:37:42,000
The thing that I don't like is the fact that you have been on the show about 14 or 15 times,

1428
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:46,000
in which the lifestyle you received, you were vigorously attacking.

1429
01:37:46,000 --> 01:37:49,000
It seems to be your purpose to attack me personally.

1430
01:37:49,000 --> 01:37:53,000
I don't know why, because there are dozens and dozens of researchers around the country

1431
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:55,000
operating on contributions.

1432
01:37:55,000 --> 01:37:57,000
Many of the great colleges.

1433
01:38:13,000 --> 01:38:20,000
Well, now we've been discussing this morning about truth and evidence and things of that nature.

1434
01:38:20,000 --> 01:38:27,000
And in discussing it, it seems that you've brought up the point, and George Vantappan has brought up the point,

1435
01:38:27,000 --> 01:38:32,000
that you are not interested in proving anything.

1436
01:38:32,000 --> 01:38:40,000
You want to tell the story when you have the opportunity, and it certainly has proven to me, at least,

1437
01:38:40,000 --> 01:38:42,000
that you're interested in telling the story.

1438
01:38:42,000 --> 01:38:46,000
You have lectured in different parts of the country, and you've written a few books,

1439
01:38:46,000 --> 01:38:48,000
and George has done the same thing.

1440
01:38:48,000 --> 01:38:54,000
I was just wondering, and in fact I'd like to ask the question of George Vantappan.

1441
01:38:54,000 --> 01:39:01,000
George, if you're not interested in proving anything, and this is certainly your right,

1442
01:39:01,000 --> 01:39:07,000
don't you feel that indirectly in giving the lectures and writing the books,

1443
01:39:07,000 --> 01:39:12,000
and conducting the Interplanetary Convention each year,

1444
01:39:12,000 --> 01:39:18,000
that indirectly it suggests to the listeners, whether they're listening to you give a lecture,

1445
01:39:18,000 --> 01:39:22,000
or whether they are reading one of your books,

1446
01:39:22,000 --> 01:39:30,000
that basically you are trying to tell the American public that there are saucers landing on this planet,

1447
01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:34,000
and that people are arriving here from other planets, and that they're here to do as good?

1448
01:39:34,000 --> 01:39:40,000
Definitely. We're trying to tell people some facts that are being withheld from the people.

1449
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:46,000
I think you could put it this way. I can see the controversy is going to develop.

1450
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:54,000
If the city engineer goes out into the park, into the city park, and puts a drink in fountain out there,

1451
01:39:54,000 --> 01:39:59,000
he is not particularly concerned whether any individual drinks from that fountain are not.

1452
01:39:59,000 --> 01:40:02,000
It is his job to make that water available.

1453
01:40:02,000 --> 01:40:09,000
If anyone wants to drink from it, why they can't, and if they don't, why there's no compulsion for whatever it is to do so.

1454
01:40:09,000 --> 01:40:14,000
Well, let me get back with George a moment, and this is not on personalities, George,

1455
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:18,000
because you've been on the program before, and you've been with me a couple of times this trip,

1456
01:40:18,000 --> 01:40:24,000
and I've had the pleasure of visiting with you out in California.

1457
01:40:25,000 --> 01:40:33,000
Don't you feel that when we talk, rather when you tell us about a rejuvenating machine,

1458
01:40:33,000 --> 01:40:42,000
and tell us about telepathic communications and these other machines, these electronic instruments that you have knowledge of,

1459
01:40:42,000 --> 01:40:50,000
and you discuss it, do you think that it's wrong for people to want to question you and get more information about it?

1460
01:40:50,000 --> 01:40:57,000
No, I don't object to anybody questioning me or coming and finding out anything that we are ready to release.

1461
01:40:57,000 --> 01:41:07,000
Well, of course, unfortunately, not all of us are in a position financially, and as far as time is concerned, to take a trip out to California.

1462
01:41:07,000 --> 01:41:09,000
I was one of the more fortunate ones.

1463
01:41:09,000 --> 01:41:11,000
Well, that's true enough, John.

1464
01:41:11,000 --> 01:41:17,000
I have one project going in Detroit that I turned over to a man there who,

1465
01:41:17,000 --> 01:41:24,000
because in my opinion he's one of the few people in the United States qualified in our scientific field to handle a job.

1466
01:41:24,000 --> 01:41:26,000
Can you tell us something about this project?

1467
01:41:26,000 --> 01:41:30,000
Yes, it's a conoscope. It's what the space people call a conoscope.

1468
01:41:30,000 --> 01:41:42,000
What it is, we have many of them today which are really replicas or duplicates or counterfeits of the real thing.

1469
01:41:42,000 --> 01:41:50,000
The original conoscope is counterfeited today in what we call a crystal ball.

1470
01:41:50,000 --> 01:41:59,000
The original conoscope is made up in such a manner that the tuning of it is controlled by the thought of the individual looking into it.

1471
01:41:59,000 --> 01:42:01,000
Does it look like a crystal ball?

1472
01:42:01,000 --> 01:42:03,000
It looks like a crystal ball when it's finished.

1473
01:42:03,000 --> 01:42:04,000
When it's finished?

1474
01:42:04,000 --> 01:42:16,000
This man who happens to be conducting this particular research and making these parts, they've went to this thing because they aren't just one ball or many parts.

1475
01:42:16,000 --> 01:42:24,000
And the axis of these particular crystals have to be in relative directions to form three planes.

1476
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:30,000
There's also three of the primary colors that go in the three planes.

1477
01:42:30,000 --> 01:42:38,000
This thing will reproduce by thinking into it. It will reproduce whatever you desire to see.

1478
01:42:38,000 --> 01:42:42,000
Red, black, and you'll bring it to the full color and motion, just like a motion picture.

1479
01:42:42,000 --> 01:42:44,000
What will it do for us?

1480
01:42:44,000 --> 01:42:52,000
If you want to see your mother, say in Nebraska or someplace, you could look in it and think of your mother and you would see her.

1481
01:42:52,000 --> 01:42:55,000
Full motion, full color.

1482
01:42:55,000 --> 01:42:58,000
This is one of the devices they carry around their pockets.

1483
01:42:58,000 --> 01:43:05,000
This thing they developed thousands of years ago and the one thousand years ago they developed it.

1484
01:43:05,000 --> 01:43:12,000
Well, they've had it for long enough so that they had them before they built the Great Pyramid.

1485
01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:23,000
The predictions made by Nostradamus were the result of his acquiring one of the few true conoscopes that were lost on this planet around the Great Pyramid.

1486
01:43:23,000 --> 01:43:25,000
Has he mentioned it in his book?

1487
01:43:25,000 --> 01:43:27,000
No, he doesn't think.

1488
01:43:27,000 --> 01:43:41,000
Without the necessity of assembling tubes and scopes and so forth, you could transmit from one of these crystals to any other crystal that were tuned to it.

1489
01:43:42,000 --> 01:43:46,000
And use it that way as a television device.

1490
01:43:46,000 --> 01:43:48,000
I think you have a question.

1491
01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:51,000
That's a question that is just a very slight comment.

1492
01:43:51,000 --> 01:44:01,000
You know, I can't tell it again, but being impressed by the similarity of what you're describing with some things that we find in this section.

1493
01:44:01,000 --> 01:44:14,000
When you're describing here, for example, it's very similar to what Richard's story was about Richard's favor, which is feared in obviously not in our magazine, but in one of our competing magazines.

1494
01:44:14,000 --> 01:44:19,000
Practically, not word for word, but symbol for symbol.

1495
01:44:19,000 --> 01:44:21,000
It's very interesting.

1496
01:44:21,000 --> 01:44:26,000
It was also described by H. G. Wells in his book of short stories called The Crystal Age.

1497
01:44:26,000 --> 01:44:29,000
Is it possible that he was familiar with the conoscopes then?

1498
01:44:29,000 --> 01:44:36,000
Very possible that he was given telepathic information to write that article.

1499
01:44:36,000 --> 01:44:39,000
The instrument itself is under construction.

1500
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:43,000
It requires a terrific amount of accuracy.

1501
01:44:43,000 --> 01:44:51,000
And this man who is doing the work is fully qualified and he can produce anything in the way of crystal.

1502
01:44:51,000 --> 01:44:53,000
Is that his qualification?

1503
01:44:53,000 --> 01:45:02,000
Well, the fact that he makes precision bearings and imitation precious stones for the United States government should be sufficient qualification.

1504
01:45:02,000 --> 01:45:06,000
He has ever since World War II, at his distance.

1505
01:45:06,000 --> 01:45:11,000
I wonder if I can ask one question if I might, Mr. Gerald Castle.

1506
01:45:11,000 --> 01:45:18,000
I know it certainly wouldn't want to give the name out over the air, but if you mind write it, it's an issue of paper.

1507
01:45:18,000 --> 01:45:22,000
Maybe to address and give it to Long John, I don't want to say it.

1508
01:45:22,000 --> 01:45:25,000
What could it do for me to give it to Long John?

1509
01:45:25,000 --> 01:45:27,000
I think possibly John might be interested.

1510
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:29,000
I just disinterested.

1511
01:45:29,000 --> 01:45:33,000
I have a case of interest on me and I don't know it by memory.

1512
01:45:33,000 --> 01:45:37,000
I have too many places and too many people. I have to keep this all in paper.

1513
01:45:37,000 --> 01:45:42,000
But this is unusual. This conoscope, isn't it? It seemed to me that it would make it great.

1514
01:45:42,000 --> 01:45:50,000
I think it's unusual. I think it's something that we would have had a long time ago if we'd quit trying to blow each other up and devoted our science to constructive things.

1515
01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:52,000
To ask John a question.

1516
01:45:52,000 --> 01:45:59,000
John, you went to Yepa Valley. We are so fortunate as to watch any of the rejuvenation processes, obelisads, or the like.

1517
01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:08,000
No, during the time that I was in Yepa Valley, California, in all fairness to George Van Tassel, George was extremely busy out there.

1518
01:46:08,000 --> 01:46:19,000
We had some seven or eight thousand people on Saturday and a like a number on Sunday, it was the 11th and 12th of May.

1519
01:46:19,000 --> 01:46:26,000
Very frankly, I only had the opportunity of talking to George for a period of maybe 15 or 20 minutes.

1520
01:46:26,000 --> 01:46:37,000
It should be obvious to anybody who listened to the program, that is the page when I came back, that I had no interview with George Van Tassel.

1521
01:46:37,000 --> 01:46:42,000
He did not even have the time to spare to permit me to do an interview with George.

1522
01:46:42,000 --> 01:46:48,000
I think prior to the time you went out there, John, I believe Howard Minge had been there.

1523
01:46:48,000 --> 01:46:52,000
Yes, he was there, I think, a couple of months prior to the convention.

1524
01:46:52,000 --> 01:47:01,000
On the night of the, I won't mention the initials, a certain program, when Howard was here, I have little notes from him.

1525
01:47:01,000 --> 01:47:09,000
I have it in my briefcase now where he wrote to me and said that this rejuvenation machine, Billings, hadn't even been started yet.

1526
01:47:09,000 --> 01:47:16,000
And coming from Howard, well, I think earlier, if I recall correctly, a statement had been made that it had been started.

1527
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:17,000
Oh no.

1528
01:47:17,000 --> 01:47:19,000
What's your recollection, John?

1529
01:47:19,000 --> 01:47:21,000
I showed John the blueprint here, nice poor lad.

1530
01:47:21,000 --> 01:47:23,000
So I'm talking about in the pool.

1531
01:47:23,000 --> 01:47:27,000
I, evidently, I am confused at this point in all fairness to George.

1532
01:47:27,000 --> 01:47:29,000
I don't have any tapes of the show.

1533
01:47:29,000 --> 01:47:39,000
I was under the impression that George had made the statement that there were two brain specialists with him in the desert at the time that they conducted this experiment with the lizard with the crushed head.

1534
01:47:39,000 --> 01:47:46,000
And also, I was under the impression that the foundation for this building had been constructed.

1535
01:47:46,000 --> 01:47:48,000
I could be wrong.

1536
01:47:48,000 --> 01:47:52,000
John, can I ask you, I remember Howard writing the note and talking about it.

1537
01:47:53,000 --> 01:47:56,000
I can confirm that.

1538
01:47:56,000 --> 01:47:57,000
I have a question.

1539
01:47:57,000 --> 01:47:58,000
Well, there isn't a building there.

1540
01:47:58,000 --> 01:48:01,000
There isn't a question about whether Howard said it or who said it.

1541
01:48:01,000 --> 01:48:04,000
There isn't any building there because we haven't started yet.

1542
01:48:04,000 --> 01:48:05,000
What building does that?

1543
01:48:05,000 --> 01:48:07,000
There's two buildings.

1544
01:48:07,000 --> 01:48:18,000
One was required by the county because the research laboratory cannot contain any metal in the structure, therefore, in order to have toilet facilities for sanitary conditions,

1545
01:48:18,000 --> 01:48:27,000
the county building and safety commission required that we put up a different building for the sanitary facility.

1546
01:48:27,000 --> 01:48:32,000
So that building is up and the observatory is up.

1547
01:48:32,000 --> 01:48:42,000
Now, the observatory is only temporary in the fact that the dome and the pending to reflect your telescope on the top of it are only temporary.

1548
01:48:42,000 --> 01:48:46,000
There's a put up there until we get the radio telescope.

1549
01:48:46,000 --> 01:48:49,000
There's a mount on that building on that track.

1550
01:48:49,000 --> 01:48:53,000
I saw a pardoning moment to Jules.

1551
01:48:53,000 --> 01:49:05,000
As you know, I'm not a lawyer, but I did see some papers that were rather impressive and I am led to believe, according to these papers, which had all the seals and all those sort of things on it.

1552
01:49:05,000 --> 01:49:12,000
And that George van Tassel and his wife donated some 10 acres.

1553
01:49:12,000 --> 01:49:14,000
Is that the correct amount?

1554
01:49:14,000 --> 01:49:19,000
Ten acres of property to the College of Universal Wisdom.

1555
01:49:19,000 --> 01:49:21,000
I saw these papers.

1556
01:49:21,000 --> 01:49:23,000
Now, I'm not an attorney.

1557
01:49:23,000 --> 01:49:33,000
If I understand Mr. Van Tassel and Mrs. Van Tassel, I trust these of the proceedings of the College of Universal Wisdom.

1558
01:49:33,000 --> 01:49:42,000
I understand that according to Mr. Van Tassel, he is the person who signs the checks.

1559
01:49:42,000 --> 01:49:43,000
That's right.

1560
01:49:43,000 --> 01:49:44,000
Who endorses the checks.

1561
01:49:44,000 --> 01:49:50,000
In other words, the financial structure of this organization is within his hands.

1562
01:49:50,000 --> 01:50:00,000
I heard him say further, I believe, in Wednesday morning that the money had to be properly applied, for example, for transportation.

1563
01:50:00,000 --> 01:50:01,000
I want to ask you this question.

1564
01:50:01,000 --> 01:50:03,000
I think I don't want to answer Mr. Van Tassel.

1565
01:50:03,000 --> 01:50:05,000
I'm going to press you on your transportation.

1566
01:50:05,000 --> 01:50:10,000
Why does that take in that the College of Universal Wisdom pays for?

1567
01:50:10,000 --> 01:50:11,000
Transportation.

1568
01:50:11,000 --> 01:50:28,000
That takes in anything in which any of our research or flying saucers are discussed or any of the research that I have to go around the country on, because I have some more things being made in other places besides Detroit.

1569
01:50:28,000 --> 01:50:34,000
That takes in anything that, in other words, some of our contributions are given string-free.

1570
01:50:34,000 --> 01:50:39,000
There's no specific use for it by the donors.

1571
01:50:39,000 --> 01:50:40,000
I'm going to ask you one more time.

1572
01:50:40,000 --> 01:50:46,000
Do you think that the way we wish, if we're providing, if used for college work?

1573
01:50:46,000 --> 01:50:47,000
Yes.

1574
01:50:47,000 --> 01:50:53,000
Now, I assume that your trip east would be paid out of the transportation fund of the college tonight, right?

1575
01:50:53,000 --> 01:50:54,000
It could be.

1576
01:50:54,000 --> 01:50:55,000
Well, no.

1577
01:50:55,000 --> 01:50:57,000
In case it didn't happen to be, but it could be.

1578
01:50:57,000 --> 01:50:58,000
I see.

1579
01:50:58,000 --> 01:51:04,000
And also understand, this is solely through contributions that the bank accounts of the college is built up.

1580
01:51:04,000 --> 01:51:05,000
That's right.

1581
01:51:05,000 --> 01:51:09,000
Now, on some occasions, I assume then, your transportation is paid by the college.

1582
01:51:09,000 --> 01:51:10,000
That's right.

1583
01:51:10,000 --> 01:51:18,000
May I ask you, sir, how to understand tonight, you had approximately 1,500 persons at the election, and I believe a dollar, a dollar fifty a piece.

1584
01:51:18,000 --> 01:51:22,000
You're turning this money over to the College of Precision of the University.

1585
01:51:22,000 --> 01:51:29,000
If I share that money, Dan will get half of it nationally, and my share of it will be turned into the college.

1586
01:51:29,000 --> 01:51:38,000
Because everything I make of my own money, whether it be there or any way that I may make money, is turned over directly to the college.

1587
01:51:38,000 --> 01:51:42,000
I have no individual, private money of my own.

1588
01:51:42,000 --> 01:51:43,000
Oh, I'm sorry.

1589
01:51:43,000 --> 01:51:46,000
I thought you said there were only contributions made up of the bank accounts.

1590
01:51:46,000 --> 01:51:47,000
That's right.

1591
01:51:47,000 --> 01:51:48,000
And that is a contribution.

1592
01:51:48,000 --> 01:51:49,000
I believe it is.

1593
01:51:49,000 --> 01:51:56,000
I can offer anything I make to the college in all fairness to George.

1594
01:51:56,000 --> 01:52:01,000
Tonight, this was not an admission fee.

1595
01:52:01,000 --> 01:52:03,000
This was a donation.

1596
01:52:03,000 --> 01:52:04,000
It was published.

1597
01:52:04,000 --> 01:52:07,000
Could you get in if you didn't donate on the other day?

1598
01:52:07,000 --> 01:52:10,000
It was marked that way, Joel.

1599
01:52:10,000 --> 01:52:11,000
I wasn't there yet, George.

1600
01:52:11,000 --> 01:52:16,000
But the fact that you're all about me, I personally enjoyed the list of 70-65 people.

1601
01:52:16,000 --> 01:52:17,000
I went in without telling you.

1602
01:52:17,000 --> 01:52:24,000
Well, I understand that according to reports of people who were there, they had to pony up the money before they got inside.

1603
01:52:24,000 --> 01:52:26,000
I think that some people here now were not in the corner.

1604
01:52:26,000 --> 01:52:28,000
You were standing out of the elevator without being inside.

1605
01:52:28,000 --> 01:52:31,000
Well, the idea of admission, but I'm getting out of this.

1606
01:52:31,000 --> 01:52:33,000
I understand the contradiction.

1607
01:52:33,000 --> 01:52:35,000
It didn't refer to admission.

1608
01:52:35,000 --> 01:52:42,000
But assuming that in any event, the money that goes in, you are the man who signs the checks.

1609
01:52:42,000 --> 01:52:43,000
That's right.

1610
01:52:43,000 --> 01:52:44,000
I'm the man of the organization.

1611
01:52:44,000 --> 01:52:46,000
I have to know where the money goes.

1612
01:52:46,000 --> 01:52:50,000
And there's no other trustees who with you signs the checks.

1613
01:52:50,000 --> 01:52:51,000
No.

1614
01:52:51,000 --> 01:52:52,000
No.

1615
01:52:52,000 --> 01:52:53,000
They all trust me completely.

1616
01:52:53,000 --> 01:52:54,000
I see.

1617
01:52:54,000 --> 01:53:00,000
And by any chance, do you have any financial statements to issue to the contributors?

1618
01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:02,000
Yes, we do.

1619
01:53:02,000 --> 01:53:10,000
And we make a statement every three or four months as to what progress we made on the buildings.

1620
01:53:10,000 --> 01:53:12,000
No, I'm in financial, sir.

1621
01:53:12,000 --> 01:53:13,000
We don't know.

1622
01:53:13,000 --> 01:53:18,000
We don't make a financial statement because it doesn't require to make a financial statement.

1623
01:53:18,000 --> 01:53:19,000
And the California law?

1624
01:53:19,000 --> 01:53:20,000
No.

1625
01:53:20,000 --> 01:53:22,000
I think it's not a nonprofit organization.

1626
01:53:22,000 --> 01:53:29,000
I know I have to count the college annual here or about four years of reports of three years.

1627
01:53:29,000 --> 01:53:35,000
I've been looking very closely through here to find one statement as to how much money

1628
01:53:35,000 --> 01:53:37,000
received, how much money put out.

1629
01:53:37,000 --> 01:53:40,000
Anybody that wants to examine that bank account can examine.

1630
01:53:40,000 --> 01:53:42,000
And I'm not sure who they are.

1631
01:53:42,000 --> 01:53:44,000
Well, here's a message from Roger again.

1632
01:53:44,000 --> 01:53:49,000
And you know, Roger smokes Cavalier cigarettes of one telegram here.

1633
01:53:49,000 --> 01:53:52,000
And you may want to comment on it.

1634
01:53:52,000 --> 01:53:54,000
Dan Fry.

1635
01:53:54,000 --> 01:54:03,000
The message is that if Dan Fry is so well trained and an expert, why is he appearing on such

1636
01:54:03,000 --> 01:54:05,000
a program as Vantatel?

1637
01:54:05,000 --> 01:54:11,000
Well, I would like to say to Mrs. Frank Dillon who sent the telegram that the program is

1638
01:54:11,000 --> 01:54:12,000
long gone.

1639
01:54:12,000 --> 01:54:14,000
These are my guests this morning.

1640
01:54:14,000 --> 01:54:20,000
However, I think that she's suggesting rather she's trying to imply that you're appearing

1641
01:54:20,000 --> 01:54:23,000
on the program with Vantatel.

1642
01:54:23,000 --> 01:54:26,000
Well, of course, the answer to that's very simple on John.

1643
01:54:26,000 --> 01:54:31,000
If I am required to defend myself for being here, then so are you.

1644
01:54:31,000 --> 01:54:34,000
And so is everyone else who is on the program.

1645
01:54:34,000 --> 01:54:39,000
Basically, I am there to see if I can learn something.

1646
01:54:39,000 --> 01:54:45,000
I haven't formulated any opinions that bring all the discussion that's going on here yet

1647
01:54:45,000 --> 01:54:50,000
because I haven't seen enough data come in on what the reason for opinion could be for.

1648
01:54:50,000 --> 01:54:55,000
I'm still completely open minded and I hope that before the end of the program, we will

1649
01:54:55,000 --> 01:54:58,000
actually get some data before that.

1650
01:54:59,000 --> 01:55:06,000
Well, but you are familiar with George Vantatel's method of communicating with people from other

1651
01:55:06,000 --> 01:55:07,000
planets.

1652
01:55:07,000 --> 01:55:08,000
Oh, yeah.

1653
01:55:08,000 --> 01:55:13,000
And because you've had a similar experience, you possibly feel that he evidently has the

1654
01:55:13,000 --> 01:55:14,000
same experience.

1655
01:55:14,000 --> 01:55:15,000
Is that right?

1656
01:55:15,000 --> 01:55:17,000
Well, I see no reason to disbelieve it.

1657
01:55:17,000 --> 01:55:18,000
Fine.

1658
01:55:18,000 --> 01:55:19,000
All right.

1659
01:55:19,000 --> 01:55:23,000
Since I am the one who is the detrimental aspect of this particular program.

1660
01:55:23,000 --> 01:55:25,000
This is not my opinion, George.

1661
01:55:25,000 --> 01:55:31,000
I would like to comment on it because it appears to indicate that Dan shouldn't be associating

1662
01:55:31,000 --> 01:55:35,000
with such a character as me if he is an expert.

1663
01:55:35,000 --> 01:55:40,000
Well, I don't normally associate with experts because most of them, I found, don't know what

1664
01:55:40,000 --> 01:55:41,000
they're talking about.

1665
01:55:41,000 --> 01:55:47,000
But I just want to in front of long John here show you something, John, just for this woman's

1666
01:55:47,000 --> 01:55:51,000
benefits, not the rest of the listeners because they don't care.

1667
01:55:51,000 --> 01:55:56,000
But this is a deputy sheriff bad as bad as San Bernardino County.

1668
01:55:56,000 --> 01:56:02,000
In order to get this badge and the card that goes with it, which is here, you have to pass

1669
01:56:02,000 --> 01:56:04,000
through every security in the nation.

1670
01:56:04,000 --> 01:56:09,000
You have to be spared of being any potential communists or anything like that.

1671
01:56:09,000 --> 01:56:15,000
This is an Aram of identification card issued by the Civil Aeronautics Administration.

1672
01:56:15,000 --> 01:56:23,000
This is a pilot, a airframe and power plant mechanics ticket also issued by them and

1673
01:56:23,000 --> 01:56:24,000
a state driver's license.

1674
01:56:24,000 --> 01:56:26,000
Well, you can take hands with me.

1675
01:56:26,000 --> 01:56:28,000
I'm a deputy sheriff of that city.

1676
01:56:28,000 --> 01:56:32,000
You haven't put that on by any national agency?

1677
01:56:32,000 --> 01:56:34,000
You haven't seen anything yet.

1678
01:56:34,000 --> 01:56:36,000
I want to really show this woman why Dan is associating.

1679
01:56:36,000 --> 01:56:38,000
And I'm equally as proud of my bad skills.

1680
01:56:38,000 --> 01:56:42,000
I don't mean to really show Dan the association with me.

1681
01:56:43,000 --> 01:56:46,000
I'm also an ordained minister.

1682
01:56:46,000 --> 01:56:53,000
John, I was just going to ask you, I'm getting a deputy sheriff's badge and the state of New Jersey.

1683
01:56:53,000 --> 01:56:56,000
Are there any qualifications or security clearance?

1684
01:56:56,000 --> 01:57:03,000
Well, I sincerely hope that there are, but I began it with a badge and I'm very grateful that I have the badge and the card.

1685
01:57:03,000 --> 01:57:04,000
I know we're proud of it.

1686
01:57:04,000 --> 01:57:09,000
In New York, about 10 or 12 years back, a few friends of mine wanted a badge.

1687
01:57:09,000 --> 01:57:11,000
I made two phone calls.

1688
01:57:11,000 --> 01:57:16,000
The FBI, the police department, the Treasury department, no one else checked on them.

1689
01:57:16,000 --> 01:57:18,000
They just got a badge, period.

1690
01:57:18,000 --> 01:57:22,000
Well, if you're asking me if they checked on me, frankly, I don't know.

1691
01:57:22,000 --> 01:57:23,000
I really don't know.

1692
01:57:23,000 --> 01:57:30,000
It's very hard for me to comprehend how every security facility in the nation would check on a deputy sheriff

1693
01:57:30,000 --> 01:57:33,000
at San Bernardino County, is it in California?

1694
01:57:33,000 --> 01:57:34,000
San Bernardino.

1695
01:57:34,000 --> 01:57:43,000
All I know, Jules, is that's what they told me at the sheriff's office when I took the examination and the requirements that I had to fulfill,

1696
01:57:43,000 --> 01:57:53,000
was that you couldn't possibly be a peace officer under the national emergency laws unless you were cleared by all securities of the nation.

1697
01:57:53,000 --> 01:57:54,000
On time.

1698
01:57:54,000 --> 01:57:57,000
I should also admit them in all fairness.

1699
01:57:57,000 --> 01:58:00,000
I'm not sure if you're going to agree with me, but I'm not sure.

1700
01:58:00,000 --> 01:58:01,000
I'm not sure.

1701
01:58:01,000 --> 01:58:02,000
I'm not sure.

1702
01:58:02,000 --> 01:58:03,000
I'm not sure.

1703
01:58:03,000 --> 01:58:04,000
I'm not sure.

1704
01:58:04,000 --> 01:58:05,000
I'm not sure.

1705
01:58:05,000 --> 01:58:06,000
I'm not sure.

1706
01:58:06,000 --> 01:58:07,000
I'm not sure.

1707
01:58:07,000 --> 01:58:08,000
I'm not sure.

1708
01:58:08,000 --> 01:58:09,000
I'm not sure.

1709
01:58:09,000 --> 01:58:10,000
I'm not sure.

1710
01:58:10,000 --> 01:58:11,000
I'm not sure.

1711
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:12,000
I'm not sure.

1712
01:58:12,000 --> 01:58:13,000
I'm not sure.

1713
01:58:13,000 --> 01:58:14,000
I'm not sure.

1714
01:58:14,000 --> 01:58:15,000
I'm not sure.

1715
01:58:15,000 --> 01:58:16,000
I'm not sure.

1716
01:58:16,000 --> 01:58:17,000
I'm not sure.

1717
01:58:17,000 --> 01:58:18,000
I'm not sure.

1718
01:58:18,000 --> 01:58:19,000
I'm not sure.

1719
01:58:19,000 --> 01:58:20,000
I'm not sure.

1720
01:58:20,000 --> 01:58:21,000
I'm not sure.

1721
01:58:21,000 --> 01:58:22,000
I'm not sure.

1722
01:58:22,000 --> 01:58:23,000
I'm not sure.

1723
01:58:23,000 --> 01:58:24,000
I'm not sure.

1724
01:58:24,000 --> 01:58:25,000
I'm not sure.

1725
01:58:25,000 --> 01:58:26,000
I'm not sure.

1726
01:58:26,000 --> 01:58:27,000
I'm not sure.

1727
01:58:27,000 --> 01:58:28,000
I'm not sure.

1728
01:58:28,000 --> 01:58:29,000
I'm not sure.

1729
01:58:29,000 --> 01:58:30,000
I'm not sure.

1730
01:58:30,000 --> 01:58:31,000
I'm not sure.

1731
01:58:31,000 --> 01:58:32,000
I'm not sure.

1732
01:58:32,000 --> 01:58:33,000
I'm not sure.

1733
01:58:33,000 --> 01:58:34,000
I'm not sure.

1734
01:58:34,000 --> 01:58:35,000
I'm not sure.

1735
01:58:35,000 --> 01:58:36,000
I'm not sure.

1736
01:58:36,000 --> 01:58:37,000
I'm not sure.

1737
01:58:37,000 --> 01:58:38,000
I'm not sure.

1738
01:58:38,000 --> 01:58:39,000
I'm not sure.

1739
01:58:39,000 --> 01:58:40,000
I'm not sure.

1740
01:58:40,000 --> 01:58:41,000
I'm not sure.

1741
01:58:41,000 --> 01:58:42,000
I'm not sure.

1742
01:58:42,000 --> 01:58:43,000
I'm not sure.

1743
01:58:43,000 --> 01:58:44,000
I'm not sure.

1744
01:58:44,000 --> 01:58:45,000
I'm not sure.

1745
01:58:45,000 --> 01:58:46,000
I'm not sure.

1746
01:58:46,000 --> 01:58:47,000
I'm not sure.

1747
01:58:47,000 --> 01:58:48,000
I'm not sure.

1748
01:58:48,000 --> 01:58:49,000
I'm not sure.

1749
01:58:49,000 --> 01:58:50,000
I'm not sure.

1750
01:58:50,000 --> 01:58:51,000
I'm not sure.

1751
01:58:51,000 --> 01:58:52,000
I'm not sure.

1752
01:58:52,000 --> 01:58:53,000
I'm not sure.

1753
01:58:53,000 --> 01:58:54,000
I'm not sure.

1754
01:58:54,000 --> 01:58:55,000
I'm not sure.

1755
01:58:55,000 --> 01:58:56,000
I'm not sure.

1756
01:58:56,000 --> 01:58:57,000
I'm not sure.

1757
01:58:57,000 --> 01:58:58,000
I'm not sure.

1758
01:58:58,000 --> 01:58:59,000
I'm not sure.

1759
01:58:59,000 --> 01:59:00,000
I'm not sure.

1760
01:59:00,000 --> 01:59:01,000
I'm not sure.

1761
01:59:01,000 --> 01:59:02,000
I'm not sure.

1762
01:59:02,000 --> 01:59:03,000
I'm not sure.

1763
01:59:03,000 --> 01:59:04,000
I'm not sure.

1764
01:59:04,000 --> 01:59:05,000
I'm not sure.

1765
01:59:05,000 --> 01:59:06,000
I'm not sure.

1766
01:59:06,000 --> 01:59:07,000
I'm not sure.

1767
01:59:07,000 --> 01:59:08,000
I'm not sure.

1768
01:59:08,000 --> 01:59:09,000
I'm not sure.

1769
01:59:09,000 --> 01:59:10,000
I'm not sure.

1770
01:59:10,000 --> 01:59:11,000
I'm not sure.

1771
01:59:11,000 --> 01:59:12,000
I'm not sure.

1772
01:59:12,000 --> 01:59:13,000
But I'm quite sure though.

1773
01:59:13,000 --> 01:59:14,000
I'm not sure.

1774
01:59:14,000 --> 01:59:15,000
I'm not sure.

1775
01:59:15,000 --> 01:59:16,000
I'm not sure.

1776
01:59:16,000 --> 01:59:17,000
No, I'm not sure.

1777
01:59:17,000 --> 01:59:18,000
I'm not sure.

1778
01:59:18,000 --> 01:59:19,000
So I'm not sure.

1779
01:59:19,000 --> 01:59:20,000
I'm not sure.

1780
01:59:20,000 --> 01:59:21,000
I'm not sure.

1781
01:59:21,000 --> 01:59:22,000
I'm not sure.

1782
01:59:22,000 --> 01:59:26,840
said about you. You think we could wrap this up and say three or four minutes?

1783
01:59:26,840 --> 01:59:36,160
I frankly don't know. He has stated, I just want to have a couple of things, referring

1784
01:59:36,160 --> 01:59:39,080
to me. I mean, there is one paragraph, John.

1785
01:59:39,080 --> 01:59:40,080
Please do.

1786
01:59:40,080 --> 01:59:43,520
The confessions of this faker, that's me.

1787
01:59:43,520 --> 01:59:47,720
I mean, you're reading from the procedure, David, June?

1788
01:59:47,720 --> 01:59:54,360
I'm reading from the procedure stated April May, 1957, the long article. The confessions

1789
01:59:54,360 --> 02:00:03,360
of this faker only reveals a sadistic desire to have others. This is proven by the attack

1790
02:00:03,360 --> 02:00:12,760
upon someone 3,000 miles away at the instigation of the forces of safety, where the typical

1791
02:00:12,760 --> 02:00:20,000
hush-hush group of the military has decided yet, George, whether or not you're referred

1792
02:00:20,000 --> 02:00:21,440
to as a faker in that paragraph.

1793
02:00:21,440 --> 02:00:25,760
Yes, but yes, that's, oh yes. I've been told a dozen times here. Well, this is read over

1794
02:00:25,760 --> 02:00:31,280
the years, but I'd like to find out if my question is, have I done this at the instigation of

1795
02:00:31,280 --> 02:00:34,440
safety or the hush-hush group of the military? Have you found out yet?

1796
02:00:34,440 --> 02:00:38,240
Well, you certainly didn't do it at the instigation of the people of the Golden Rule.

1797
02:00:38,520 --> 02:00:44,800
Well, I say very well, very well, my whole motive in being here is based upon the Golden

1798
02:00:44,800 --> 02:00:48,080
Rule. I'd like you to do it and others, as I'd like them to do to me.

1799
02:00:48,080 --> 02:00:49,560
You should have come and found out.

1800
02:00:49,560 --> 02:00:55,520
The question is just, Mr. Bentaville, you say I did it at the instigation of the forces

1801
02:00:55,520 --> 02:01:00,800
of safety and I repeat, or the typical hush-hush group of the military.

1802
02:01:00,800 --> 02:01:01,800
Well, the reason I say that.

1803
02:01:01,800 --> 02:01:02,800
Now, will you explain this?

1804
02:01:03,360 --> 02:01:09,800
Well, I think I've decided if I am being incited by the military, I'm going to be

1805
02:01:09,800 --> 02:01:10,800
going to the military.

1806
02:01:10,800 --> 02:01:14,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1807
02:01:14,800 --> 02:01:18,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1808
02:01:18,800 --> 02:01:22,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1809
02:01:22,800 --> 02:01:26,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1810
02:01:26,800 --> 02:01:31,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1811
02:01:31,800 --> 02:01:34,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1812
02:01:34,800 --> 02:01:38,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1813
02:01:38,800 --> 02:01:42,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1814
02:01:42,800 --> 02:01:45,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1815
02:01:45,800 --> 02:01:48,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1816
02:01:48,800 --> 02:01:51,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1817
02:01:51,800 --> 02:01:55,800
Well, I think I've decided that I'm going to be going to the military.

1818
02:01:55,800 --> 02:01:57,800
Well, you have a point of order,ẫn the travelled long distance

1819
02:01:57,800 --> 02:02:04,280
and then the people and your chat wp

1820
02:02:15,800 --> 02:02:19,800
reparations to the military.

1821
02:02:19,800 --> 02:02:22,520
I don't know, or I wouldn't have suggested to.

1822
02:02:22,520 --> 02:02:24,640
I mean, you're sure it's one of the other.

1823
02:02:24,640 --> 02:02:25,640
No, I didn't say that.

1824
02:02:25,640 --> 02:02:26,640
It could be other reasons.

1825
02:02:26,640 --> 02:02:29,640
Oh, well, maybe I'm missing it.

1826
02:02:29,640 --> 02:02:33,840
May I just ask this question a moment?

1827
02:02:33,840 --> 02:02:39,440
I think when you showed me those cards there, the various organizations that you're associated

1828
02:02:39,440 --> 02:02:43,680
with, you also mentioned that you're an ordained minister.

1829
02:02:43,680 --> 02:02:44,680
You did show me the cards.

1830
02:02:44,680 --> 02:02:45,680
That's right.

1831
02:02:45,680 --> 02:02:46,680
But I didn't read it frankly.

1832
02:02:46,680 --> 02:02:48,680
But what is the church for George?

1833
02:02:48,680 --> 02:02:50,680
The Christ Brotherhood Church.

1834
02:02:50,680 --> 02:02:52,680
And when were you ordained?

1835
02:02:52,680 --> 02:02:54,680
Just this year.

1836
02:02:54,680 --> 02:02:55,680
This year.

1837
02:02:55,680 --> 02:02:56,680
Fine.

1838
02:02:56,680 --> 02:02:59,440
I wonder as long as George brought up the subject, George, if you could explain what

1839
02:02:59,440 --> 02:03:04,120
are the requirements for a minister to be an ordained in the state of California.

1840
02:03:04,120 --> 02:03:06,120
I haven't the faintest idea.

1841
02:03:06,120 --> 02:03:07,120
What's the requirement, Sarah?

1842
02:03:07,120 --> 02:03:09,120
You mean you just get ordained?

1843
02:03:09,120 --> 02:03:16,000
Normally in the process of ordaining ministers or receiving doctors degrees in this country

1844
02:03:16,000 --> 02:03:25,120
anywhere, it seems to be that it's possible to be appointed or ordained to anything, providing

1845
02:03:25,120 --> 02:03:29,520
somebody connected with that particular thing chooses to ordain you.

1846
02:03:29,520 --> 02:03:30,520
Well, I understand.

1847
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:35,260
I want to, I just brought up, by the way, to be a minister until I tell him to the

1848
02:03:35,260 --> 02:03:36,260
Fourth of the Seif.

1849
02:03:36,260 --> 02:03:39,260
But for the military.

1850
02:03:39,260 --> 02:03:47,340
But my understanding was that you had to appear before a board, before you were ordained

1851
02:03:47,340 --> 02:03:48,340
in most of the churches.

1852
02:03:48,340 --> 02:03:53,340
Well, that's not going to be the process of ordination, because I don't frankly know

1853
02:03:53,340 --> 02:03:54,340
what they are.

1854
02:03:54,340 --> 02:03:59,660
I mean, you know, I know that the card was sent to me on the basis of the fact that

1855
02:03:59,660 --> 02:04:03,660
the group that ordained me felt that I was teaching the Word of God.

1856
02:04:03,660 --> 02:04:05,660
That's the reason I was down.

1857
02:04:05,660 --> 02:04:07,660
That's what they told me.

1858
02:04:08,060 --> 02:04:09,340
All right.

1859
02:04:09,340 --> 02:04:11,020
I think that's the answer to that question.

1860
02:04:11,020 --> 02:04:16,020
I just thought on all fairness that the fact that George Vantassel is an ordained minister,

1861
02:04:16,020 --> 02:04:21,020
that possibly some of our listeners would be interested in knowing the name of the church

1862
02:04:21,020 --> 02:04:23,020
that he's associated with.

1863
02:04:23,020 --> 02:04:25,460
All right. Now, did you want to get into something about the procedure?

1864
02:04:25,460 --> 02:04:27,460
I think Hans wanted to talk to you.

1865
02:04:27,460 --> 02:04:32,980
Yes, I had a couple of points I wanted to ask about.

1866
02:04:32,980 --> 02:04:42,540
In some cases based upon the bulletin of civilian software intelligence, CSI, who, by the way,

1867
02:04:42,540 --> 02:04:45,340
describe you, George, as a...

1868
02:04:45,340 --> 02:04:47,340
What is the date of this particular bulletin?

1869
02:04:47,340 --> 02:04:51,660
The particular bulletin I'm referring to is dated December 15, 1956.

1870
02:04:51,660 --> 02:04:53,660
I think this is the one that you referred to before.

1871
02:04:53,660 --> 02:04:57,860
I think George had the opportunity to refer to earlier.

1872
02:04:57,940 --> 02:05:04,100
And that incidentally, while, of course, they do say one or two slightly critical things about you,

1873
02:05:04,100 --> 02:05:06,100
they referred to you.

1874
02:05:06,100 --> 02:05:14,220
I wanted to point out to you that they referred to you as the Hanson broadface, fair-haired man in his early 40s,

1875
02:05:14,220 --> 02:05:20,140
with a pleasant voice and an easy-going manner of speech, something which I completely agree with him.

1876
02:05:20,140 --> 02:05:22,140
On the basis of this person...

1877
02:05:22,140 --> 02:05:24,140
Well, we're in agreement. I want to think about it anyway.

1878
02:05:24,140 --> 02:05:26,140
Yeah, yeah, I have two here.

1879
02:05:26,140 --> 02:05:29,140
Of course. You don't have three. I have two here.

1880
02:05:29,140 --> 02:05:31,140
You have two hands?

1881
02:05:31,140 --> 02:05:35,140
You sound like some sort of escape from the country, paid to do my magazine.

1882
02:05:35,140 --> 02:05:39,140
By the way, well, no...

1883
02:05:39,140 --> 02:05:41,140
Yes, yes, yes, I'm right.

1884
02:05:41,140 --> 02:05:46,140
I do have one or two points, and I would like to mention before the break,

1885
02:05:46,140 --> 02:05:55,140
because I am afraid I will have to leave, assuming after that I have to be in the office at a reasonably decent hour in the morning, you know.

1886
02:05:55,140 --> 02:06:03,140
I have a couple of questions, some of which I have been accumulating over a period of time, and I also have with John's indulgence,

1887
02:06:03,140 --> 02:06:18,140
I want to say this one thing, that I have a rather lengthy article on contact cases coming up in a early issue of Santa Monica Universe,

1888
02:06:18,140 --> 02:06:23,140
which I think is quite likely to interest you and others.

1889
02:06:23,140 --> 02:06:28,140
And I want to say that I'll be delighted when you're doing the copies of it,

1890
02:06:28,140 --> 02:06:31,140
in case you would like to comment on it.

1891
02:06:31,140 --> 02:06:32,140
Okay.

1892
02:06:32,140 --> 02:06:36,140
Now, I have two questions. One is...

1893
02:06:36,140 --> 02:06:40,140
You mentioned Deputy Sheriff Badge.

1894
02:06:40,140 --> 02:06:42,140
State 7, yeah.

1895
02:06:42,140 --> 02:06:47,140
You mentioned Deputy Sheriff Badge.

1896
02:06:47,140 --> 02:06:54,140
I don't deny... I don't mean to cast dispatchmen to found the Deputy Sheriff Badge,

1897
02:06:54,140 --> 02:07:01,140
another time been in the Dino County in California or elsewhere,

1898
02:07:01,140 --> 02:07:15,140
but I do think you must have read about instances where these badges were issued to people who had some, let's say, sound standing in the community,

1899
02:07:15,140 --> 02:07:21,140
were reasonably well known, but who were not necessarily dedicated persons.

1900
02:07:21,140 --> 02:07:22,140
That's right.

1901
02:07:22,140 --> 02:07:27,140
I can think of one man... I can think of... Oh, I'm not suggesting that it isn't so in your case,

1902
02:07:27,140 --> 02:07:35,140
but I can think of one man, for example, in Arizona, who was a business partner of the previous Attorney General of the State of Arizona,

1903
02:07:35,140 --> 02:07:40,140
who is no longer either an attorney general or a lawyer.

1904
02:07:40,140 --> 02:07:51,140
This gentleman is committed a few business dealing, and in the course of which he got the Deputy Sheriff Badge.

1905
02:07:51,140 --> 02:07:53,140
I understand that way.

1906
02:07:53,140 --> 02:08:00,140
Well, let me tell you that this badge is not an honorary confirmant.

1907
02:08:00,140 --> 02:08:03,140
As John said, he probably has an honorary badge.

1908
02:08:03,140 --> 02:08:04,140
It's very possible.

1909
02:08:04,140 --> 02:08:09,140
This badge is committed under bond. I'm a bond of deputy, the same as any other deputy.

1910
02:08:09,140 --> 02:08:14,140
You said that you were checked by a federal and other agency.

1911
02:08:14,140 --> 02:08:24,140
I said that they told me that my application or my information has to be confirmed by other branches of security.

1912
02:08:24,140 --> 02:08:26,140
When you say they do, I mean the Sheriff's Office...

1913
02:08:26,140 --> 02:08:33,140
I think I could point out at this point that that requires only a telephone call to be checked by all of the security agencies

1914
02:08:33,140 --> 02:08:37,140
since all of the information that one has is available to all of them.

1915
02:08:37,140 --> 02:08:43,140
You could be quite fairly checked by FBI or by securities and about 50 employees by phone call.

1916
02:08:43,140 --> 02:08:49,140
In other words, by just finding out whether there is any information about the individual and their files, right?

1917
02:08:49,140 --> 02:08:51,140
After one agent of a criminal record.

1918
02:08:51,140 --> 02:08:52,140
After one agent?

1919
02:08:52,140 --> 02:08:58,140
Not only that. If the person has ever worked in any security, in any aircraft plant, in any plant that is in any way under security,

1920
02:08:58,140 --> 02:09:02,140
there is a complete or doctor or own individual with this information.

1921
02:09:02,140 --> 02:09:03,140
Hans, do you want to continue?

1922
02:09:03,140 --> 02:09:06,140
I have two or three other points.

1923
02:09:06,140 --> 02:09:14,140
I understand that you felt that there has been some suggestion in an article in Fantastic Universe

1924
02:09:14,140 --> 02:09:21,140
implying that... No, I'm sorry, not in Fantastic Universe, but in a Daily News article sometime ago,

1925
02:09:21,140 --> 02:09:29,140
implying that interest in ufology might make you suspect.

1926
02:09:29,140 --> 02:09:36,140
No, I have since read that and I want to tell John that where I read it was in Search magazine.

1927
02:09:36,140 --> 02:09:43,140
I didn't read the article, I think, but Palmer reprinted the article and I assume he reprinted it rightly.

1928
02:09:43,140 --> 02:09:49,140
And I did happen to get a copy of that Search magazine today and John was right.

1929
02:09:49,140 --> 02:09:53,140
He was referring to the people in the shift rather than contacting him.

1930
02:09:53,140 --> 02:09:56,140
Because Ben was never at any time implied...

1931
02:09:56,140 --> 02:09:58,140
Oh, no, I didn't say Ben at any time.

1932
02:09:58,140 --> 02:10:00,140
No, no, because I wanted to...

1933
02:10:00,140 --> 02:10:01,140
I said it's weird, Miss Pah.

1934
02:10:01,140 --> 02:10:03,140
...church on that point among others because I'm sure that...

1935
02:10:03,140 --> 02:10:07,140
Oh, I know Ben has been answering questions.

1936
02:10:07,140 --> 02:10:09,140
I'm sure he's been trying to imply that, you see.

1937
02:10:09,140 --> 02:10:15,140
And that there was nothing personal, just as there's nothing personal in any questions I may ask you,

1938
02:10:15,140 --> 02:10:18,140
I'm sure there was nothing personal in any point that he may have made.

1939
02:10:19,140 --> 02:10:23,140
Yeah.

1940
02:10:23,140 --> 02:10:29,140
In some time, in this civilian self-interpreting,

1941
02:10:29,140 --> 02:10:36,140
there is a reference to the two eminent brain surgeons who are not otherwise identified.

1942
02:10:36,140 --> 02:10:41,140
It happened about one-third of the way down.

1943
02:10:41,140 --> 02:10:43,140
I see.

1944
02:10:44,140 --> 02:10:50,140
The assentee told you that they had examined the brain.

1945
02:10:50,140 --> 02:10:55,140
Here it is stated of the little men from Scali's daughter, specifically.

1946
02:10:55,140 --> 02:10:57,140
And that from the appearance of these brains,

1947
02:10:57,140 --> 02:11:02,140
it could be calculated that little men were several hundred years old.

1948
02:11:02,140 --> 02:11:04,140
Do you have any further comment on that?

1949
02:11:04,140 --> 02:11:05,140
Yes, but...

1950
02:11:05,140 --> 02:11:06,140
It's an accurate...

1951
02:11:06,140 --> 02:11:08,140
What I'm wondering, yeah, what I'm trying to find out...

1952
02:11:08,140 --> 02:11:10,140
...the sense of the very difference in this article.

1953
02:11:10,140 --> 02:11:12,140
Who wrote this article?

1954
02:11:12,140 --> 02:11:13,140
I think it's a...

1955
02:11:13,140 --> 02:11:15,140
That's the thing in my publication...

1956
02:11:15,140 --> 02:11:22,140
This civilian software intelligence bulletin is written by the directors of the organization.

1957
02:11:22,140 --> 02:11:24,140
How many directors and who?

1958
02:11:24,140 --> 02:11:26,140
Two of them.

1959
02:11:26,140 --> 02:11:30,140
One is Lex Nevin, and the other gentleman is Ted Blocher.

1960
02:11:30,140 --> 02:11:36,140
Well, this seems to be an article about George Van Passel and his wonderful rejuvenation machine.

1961
02:11:36,140 --> 02:11:39,140
It sounds like Thomas Whithme's airplane, the way they tie with this.

1962
02:11:39,140 --> 02:11:41,140
May I just make this one comment, though?

1963
02:11:41,140 --> 02:11:45,140
I do know the two gentlemen happened to be in the studio here this evening.

1964
02:11:45,140 --> 02:11:46,140
That's wonderful.

1965
02:11:46,140 --> 02:11:55,140
No, the reason I say this, George, is that they based this article on tapes that they made of the party run.

1966
02:11:55,140 --> 02:12:00,140
Well, all I can say is that either they heard the tapes run or something,

1967
02:12:00,140 --> 02:12:04,140
because there was no mention of Silas Newton on the tapes that I know of.

1968
02:12:04,140 --> 02:12:07,140
And they brought that in here.

1969
02:12:07,140 --> 02:12:08,140
I can ask you.

1970
02:12:08,140 --> 02:12:13,140
They also stated, which originated with a convicted swindler, Silas Newton,

1971
02:12:13,140 --> 02:12:18,140
now to inform these people right now, in case you're listening back there,

1972
02:12:18,140 --> 02:12:20,140
that Silas Newton was not convicted.

1973
02:12:20,140 --> 02:12:24,140
You have made a statement of libel here against him, which he could sue you for.

1974
02:12:24,140 --> 02:12:27,140
You better find out what you're talking about when your friend's singing the tape.

1975
02:12:27,140 --> 02:12:31,140
You might not say this, but then True Magazine, this is guilty of libel.

1976
02:12:31,140 --> 02:12:34,140
He had published a lot of news hanging over their head right now.

1977
02:12:34,140 --> 02:12:36,140
Okay, very specific.

1978
02:12:36,140 --> 02:12:37,140
May I ask you...

1979
02:12:37,140 --> 02:12:39,140
If this is a direct quote.

1980
02:12:39,140 --> 02:12:41,140
May I continue rather?

1981
02:12:41,140 --> 02:12:43,140
Can you interrupt just one moment, please?

1982
02:12:43,140 --> 02:12:48,140
I would like to announce that any of the statements made by any of my guests this morning

1983
02:12:48,140 --> 02:12:54,140
are not necessarily the opinions of the management of W.O.R., the Mutual Network,

1984
02:12:54,140 --> 02:12:57,140
any of their affiliates, or yours truly, L.J.

1985
02:12:57,140 --> 02:12:58,140
Continue, huh?

1986
02:12:58,140 --> 02:13:01,140
May I continue?

1987
02:13:01,140 --> 02:13:10,140
This is an anchor quote in this reference to the statement they quote you as saying

1988
02:13:10,140 --> 02:13:15,140
that you know how to build saucer motors, which I grant you may be a generalization.

1989
02:13:15,140 --> 02:13:16,140
Yes, I do.

1990
02:13:16,140 --> 02:13:18,140
Any good mechanic can build them.

1991
02:13:18,140 --> 02:13:20,140
They use no fuel.

1992
02:13:20,140 --> 02:13:26,140
The administration is suppressing the truth because of the effect it would have on the oil company.